Connect and get the inside scoop on Airline Companies

Welcome to Airline Pilot Forums - Connect and get the inside scoop on Airline Companies

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ. Join our community today and start interacting with existing members. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free.


User Tag List

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-19-2013, 03:47 PM   #1  
Banned
Thread Starter
 
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,240
Default AOL update

Well since we are about to go to court as soon as the deal closes I thought aol updates would be of interest and we can keep the east/west stuff on this thread (with the moderators permission).
AOL update 2/19
Quote:
On February 8th, the pilots of US Airways voted in favor of the Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) negotiated by USAPA, US Airways, the APA and American Airlines. The MOU places all US Airways pilots under a single contract; there is no legitimate union purpose to use any other seniority scheme than the Nicolau Award. West pilots expect, and will require, the company and USAPA to honor the final and binding arbitration that resulted in the Nicolau Award.


“We conclude that this case presents contingencies that could prevent effectuation of USAPA’s proposal and the accompanying injury......Not until the airline responds to the proposal, the parties complete negotiations, and the membership ratifies the CBA will the West Pilots actually be affected by USAPA’s seniority proposal....” [Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, pg. 9]


“Although we do not hold that a DFR claim based on a union’s promotion of a policy is never ripe until that policy is effectuated......” [Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, pg. 12]


Negotiations addressing the contingencies that can affect seniority are complete. Retrospective pay began February 8th, and the rest of the MOU provisions will be imposed on all parties as we work toward a JCBA with APA.


The MOU was written to be neutral on the Nicolau Award. The process leading to the Nicolau Award was dictated by a separate section of the prior Bankruptcy Court-ordered Transition Agreement and was not subject to independent ratification apart from the other 29 sections of a new contract. Ratification of an entirely new contract, replacing both existing East and West contracts, took place in the form of the MOU passage.


The ratification vote of the MOU eviscerates USAPA’s primary argument for a Legitimate Union Purpose, as USAPA has always maintained that the Nicolau Award itself created an impasse to obtaining a joint contract:


“In effect, USAPA claims that the East Pilots hold such strong objections to the Nicolau Award that they always will vote as a bloc against any new CBA with it, enjoying the self-denial of a single CBA with improved wages and working conditions into perpetuity. Even if this unbelievable story is believed, it only means that the East Pilots have the power of self-inflicted harm. It does not mean that the union’s duty of fair representation falls victim to self-hostagetaking.


Whether considered as a matter of fact or law, the asserted impasse does not absolve USAPA from liability.” [Judge Wake, Doc. 593 pg. 29]


For years, our position has been that the "impasse" referred to by USAPA was one of its own making. Judge Wake agreed with us and referred to it in his "Statement of Facts" (doc 593) as "self-hostagetaking" and calling USAPA's claim that the East would vote "against any new CBA..... with improved wages and working conditions into perpetuity" an "unbelievable story".


The MOU vote has proven us (and Judge Wake) right: Given enough money there never was an impasse. However, pretending there was an impasse gave both USAPA and US Airways what they wanted. USAPA kept separate operations and avoided the Nicolau and management used the whipsaw to keep our wages the lowest in the industry (even lower with every hour of flying management could transfer East)!


On Monday, February 18, 2013, the attorneys for the West Pilots took the first step, post-merger announcement, by placing all parties on notice that we are prepared to take appropriate legal action to protect our right to the Nicolau Award. You may read the letter here.


Much damage has been done to US Airways pilots through USAPA’s refusal to negotiate a JCBA with improved pay and benefits prior to a merger with American Airlines. So much so that East pilots will enjoy breathtaking raises and benefit improvements by overwhelmingly ratifying the contract of a bankrupt carrier after it failed to achieve anything (except delay) while “representing” pilots at one of the industry's most profitable airlines over the last five years.


A unified front is required to secure the best possible future for US Airways pilots at the New American Airlines, but the West pilots will not forfeit our seniority rights to create that facade. Instead, we will require USAPA, US Airways, the APA and the New American Airlines to honor the clear-cut obligations to which they succeeded, (or will succeed). This means nothing less than the implementation of the Nicolau Award as the single list for the US Airways side of the AA/US integration equation. Nothing less will suffice.


Sincerely,


Leonidas, LLC
And here is the link to the attorney's letter: http://leonidas.cactuspilots.us/2013...and_Siegel.pdf

Last edited by cactiboss; 02-19-2013 at 04:07 PM.
cactiboss is offline  
Old 02-19-2013, 05:55 PM   #2  
Gets Weekends Off
 
KillingMeSmalls's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2011
Posts: 226
Default

Here is a real AOL update:

America Online still makes $500 million a year through their dial up service. Can you believe that?
KillingMeSmalls is offline  
Old 02-19-2013, 06:14 PM   #3  
Gets Weekends Off
 
lolwut's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: Doing what you do, for less.
Posts: 1,790
Default

The last AOL Update I got was on a Free CD in my mailbox.
lolwut is offline  
Old 02-19-2013, 06:22 PM   #4  
Gets Weekends Off
 
ackattacker's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Position: Pitot heat, what's to eat?
Posts: 392
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by KillingMeSmalls View Post
Here is a real AOL update:

America Online still makes $500 million a year through their dial up service. Can you believe that?
$500 million on dial up. We really are in the wrong business, aren't we?
ackattacker is offline  
Old 02-19-2013, 06:24 PM   #5  
Flies With The Hat On
 
flybywire44's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: Right of the Left Seat
Posts: 1,304
Default

In other news:


AOL: Summary for AOL Inc. AOL Inc. Common Stock- Yahoo! Finance
flybywire44 is offline  
Old 02-19-2013, 07:00 PM   #6  
Gets Weekends Off
 
lolwut's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Position: Doing what you do, for less.
Posts: 1,790
Default

So what they're saying is they plan on screwing up this merger in the courts?

Wouldn't it be funny if the west sues, gets everything screwed up, and the merger gets canceled. Then they go back to the old stalemate with the east and usapa and its business as usual forever.
lolwut is offline  
Old 02-19-2013, 08:05 PM   #7  
Banned
Thread Starter
 
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,240
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lolwut View Post
So what they're saying is they plan on screwing up this merger in the courts?

Wouldn't it be funny if the west sues, gets everything screwed up, and the merger gets canceled. Then they go back to the old stalemate with the east and usapa and its business as usual forever.
The update speaks for itself.
cactiboss is offline  
Old 02-19-2013, 08:28 PM   #8  
Gets Weekends Off
 
tailendcharlie's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Position: Airbus CA
Posts: 469
Default

Basically they're simply serving notice that in their opinion the Nic ain't going away and they intend to press the point in court if needed, in case anyone was entertaining the notion that the merger means a do-over.

Shouldn't be much of a surprise to anyone who has followed this saga the last several years....
tailendcharlie is offline  
Old 02-19-2013, 11:02 PM   #9  
Gets Weekends Off
 
cactusmike's Avatar
 
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: B777/CA
Posts: 1,419
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tailendcharlie View Post
Basically they're simply serving notice that in their opinion the Nic ain't going away and they intend to press the point in court if needed, in case anyone was entertaining the notion that the merger means a do-over.

Shouldn't be much of a surprise to anyone who has followed this saga the last several years....
That's pretty much it.

Nothing to see here, just move along now.
cactusmike is offline  
Old 02-20-2013, 03:00 AM   #10  
Gets Weekends Off
 
LittleBoyBlew's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: Bigg Bird!!
Posts: 599
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by lolwut View Post
So what they're saying is they plan on screwing up this merger in the courts?

Wouldn't it be funny if the west sues, gets everything screwed up, and the merger gets canceled. Then they go back to the old stalemate with the east and usapa and its business as usual forever.
No chance bud.. What this latest AOL tactic does is effectively alienates the west boys from the perceived harmony expected by the UCC via the now ratified MOU. I would bet my bacon that a contingency plan is baked into this merger process. Remember the Co. is not required to surrender the US Airways certificate. The contractual language in the MOU is murky enough to allow the Co. wiggle room in case this sort of thing occurs. Most annalists are already predicting a substantially reduced PHX hub.
I for one am glad that this fiasco is fast approaching maturity. Wish I could say the same about Cacti....;-) When the gavel drops, the nic will finally be put to rest..
I have spoken to several AA pilots, and THEY are not happy with the nic...

Last edited by LittleBoyBlew; 02-20-2013 at 03:17 AM.
LittleBoyBlew is offline  
 
 
 

 
Post Reply
 



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ual mec update gettinbumped United 0 12-11-2012 11:29 AM
PHX Usapa rep's update re: Merger cactiboss American 29 05-16-2012 06:24 PM
Cal mec special update (scope) LifeNtheFstLne United 51 11-16-2010 11:47 AM
Martinaire Pilot Hiring Update HSLD Hiring News 2 11-14-2006 04:32 PM
Martinaire Pilot Hiring Update HSLD Hiring News 1 02-08-2006 10:37 AM


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 01:06 AM.