ABX Air Latest
06-14-2022 | 12:26 PM
#371
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,914
Likes: 48
Perhaps address CaptainJay's comment, maybe I am using the forums to decide where I want to work and who I want to work with. Now I know there is a backlog and somebody who overReacts when somebody asks a question, maybe I don't like to sit at CVG (which isn't my home and the only domicile) and collect a paycheck, maybe I am a turnip.
Have you been paying attention to what is going on in aviation the last few years? EVERY again EVERY airline training program is backed up. Nobody hired in today's market expects an uninterrupted training footprint without some delays here and there. ABX is churning out new hires at the same rate as everyone else.
06-14-2022 | 01:28 PM
#372
On Reserve
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 87
Likes: 3
From: 1%
It my be the "now I know there is a back log" part.
Have you been paying attention to what is going on in aviation the last few years? EVERY again EVERY airline training program is backed up. Nobody hired in today's market expects an uninterrupted training footprint without some delays here and there. ABX is churning out new hires at the same rate as everyone else.
Have you been paying attention to what is going on in aviation the last few years? EVERY again EVERY airline training program is backed up. Nobody hired in today's market expects an uninterrupted training footprint without some delays here and there. ABX is churning out new hires at the same rate as everyone else.
06-14-2022 | 01:58 PM
#373
Line Holder
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 920
Likes: 3
From: Left, right & center
Perhaps address CaptainJay's comment, maybe I am using the forums to decide where I want to work and who I want to work with. Now I know there is a backlog and somebody who overReacts when somebody asks a question, maybe I don't like to sit at CVG (which isn't my home and the only domicile) and collect a paycheck, maybe I am a turnip.
120 days is just over 17 weeks. Waiting 5 weeks to start means you've got 12 more to get it done. You should easily do 40 hours in a month, which leaves enough room to get there. After IOE, you are the priority for every open trip if you're on reserve - there are no R1s for you if you're at less than 100 hours - and getting a line right off of IOE is a possibility these days. If, for some reason, the calendar hits 120 days, simulator time isn't necessarily required. An observation by a line check airman is all that is needed. For that hypothetical one or two who might, due to some exceptional circumstance, exceed 150 days, I suspect the POI would not be unreasonable about granting extensions.
Whatever happens, it's not your problem. It's somebody else's problem. Don't worry about it.
I don't have a problem with questions. I do have a problem with whining. Sure, CVG may not be anybody's favorite place to be. But when the company is paying you to be available in a scheduled availability period and paying for a hotel room to do it, I see no reason for complaint. As I pointed out previously in response to an actual question, not everybody who is awaiting IOE is doing so at the Holiday Inn CVG Airport. Most are waiting at home, and everyone should be getting their minimum 14 days off per month, so again, I see no reason for complaint. It's the job - it's what they're getting paid to do. A person could do a lot worse.
06-14-2022 | 02:05 PM
#374
Missing from the Crashpad
Joined: Jan 2022
Posts: 134
Likes: 2
From: Recliner
Again, keep in mind that they do pay for hotel and your getting paid. I’ve been hearing some frustration on the socials and thought people should know what to expect and what ABX expects from them.
If a pilot choses to come here with realistic expectations and all the information they will have a very rewarding training experience, albeit with realistic expectations of the current delays to the footprint.
06-14-2022 | 05:22 PM
#376
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,914
Likes: 48
Thank you for your insightful post, a turnip needs a little help catching on, you know after what's been going on in EVERY again EVERY airline training program (except for the one I was in). When somebody asks if sitting on R1 in a hotel is the norm, just say yes. Allow people to manage expectations, don't tell them how good it is to sit around and do nothing in your domicile and get a paycheck like that is what motivates everybody, or tell somebody how dumb they are because EVERY airline has the training sadz. JATFQ without emotion. I posted ABX vs AJT to make my decision not be learned by you and Reactor.
06-14-2022 | 10:19 PM
#377
Line Holder
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 237
Likes: 5
I've been on vaca (and still are for a bit longer...), but I have not heard of an unqualified (i.e. not completed OE) FO being assigned R1. Understanding that R1 is considered airport reserve (which we pull from the hotel...at least for now (for the cheap seats, it's not contractual and a Covid protocol that ABX put in place...it's long term is unknown when/if it will expire)). R1 crewmembers can be launched at a moments notice either individually or as a crew. Therefore the concept of having a new hire without OE actually on this duty is perplexing.
My guess, without looking into this further, is new hire FO who have not started/completed OE are tasked to be in domicile should an opening in a OE schedule become available. If they allowed one to wait at home, any short opportunities for OE training would be lost. Check pilots have constantly changing schedules, so I can easily see where this can occur. Finally as many have already stated, training is difficult for almost all airlines these days but regardless they are signing the check and new hires still cash them.
My guess, without looking into this further, is new hire FO who have not started/completed OE are tasked to be in domicile should an opening in a OE schedule become available. If they allowed one to wait at home, any short opportunities for OE training would be lost. Check pilots have constantly changing schedules, so I can easily see where this can occur. Finally as many have already stated, training is difficult for almost all airlines these days but regardless they are signing the check and new hires still cash them.
06-15-2022 | 03:44 AM
#379
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2019
Posts: 251
Likes: 0
From: CA
Here is the latest. ABX air is a top notch outfit. They treat you like a true professional you are from the start. The Training department is outstanding. That’s the good. Now the unfortunate. Training is getting delayed to an untenable level.
Like many airlines OE is backed up 4-5 weeks and climbing. That in itself isn’t unexpected but they are now assigning R1 airport reserve to people waiting for OE when there are no check airman on reserve.
New hires are now having to commute into CVG and sit days of airport reserve with little to no chance of being used unless a Check Airman happens to pick up a Premium DOF open time trip. The truth is there will be multiple reserve people waiting for OE, so it’s a crap shoot who gets to fly. They do pay for the hotel though.
There is currently a very real possibility of larger numbers of people not making consolidation in the future, and the check airman are already overworked. Captain upgrade OE is obviously taking priority over new hire FOs also.
It’s anyones guess what the long term consequences of new hires having to return to the schoolhouse for extra training will be, although I assume that will back up initial training even further due to sim availability.
To be clear I am not disparaging the company, I like it here but people need to be aware of the unfortunate situation the company is in and have some flexibility and patience if you chose to come here. The current training backup WILL affect your training at some point and I’m hearing too many people getting frustrated that they didn’t know or expect this when they arrived on property.
That’s the latest.
Like many airlines OE is backed up 4-5 weeks and climbing. That in itself isn’t unexpected but they are now assigning R1 airport reserve to people waiting for OE when there are no check airman on reserve.
New hires are now having to commute into CVG and sit days of airport reserve with little to no chance of being used unless a Check Airman happens to pick up a Premium DOF open time trip. The truth is there will be multiple reserve people waiting for OE, so it’s a crap shoot who gets to fly. They do pay for the hotel though.
There is currently a very real possibility of larger numbers of people not making consolidation in the future, and the check airman are already overworked. Captain upgrade OE is obviously taking priority over new hire FOs also.
It’s anyones guess what the long term consequences of new hires having to return to the schoolhouse for extra training will be, although I assume that will back up initial training even further due to sim availability.
To be clear I am not disparaging the company, I like it here but people need to be aware of the unfortunate situation the company is in and have some flexibility and patience if you chose to come here. The current training backup WILL affect your training at some point and I’m hearing too many people getting frustrated that they didn’t know or expect this when they arrived on property.
That’s the latest.
Now the pay rates; we’re behind the power curve and that’s another story given the record high long duration inflationary event we’re seeing. I suspect ATSG management is waiting for a recession (hint we’re in one) and is still under the impression that pilots will be “thankful to have a job”…nope. Those days are over. The regional pay hikes are band aids for a long term issue.
06-15-2022 | 04:10 AM
#380
On Reserve
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 87
Likes: 3
From: 1%
To more directly address CaptainJay's comment, I waited just short of four weeks to start IOE. I didn't have a problem with consolidation.
Whatever happens, it's not your problem. It's somebody else's problem. Don't worry about it.
I don't have a problem with questions. I do have a problem with whining. Sure, CVG may not be anybody's favorite place to be. But when the company is paying you to be available in a scheduled availability period and paying for a hotel room to do it, I see no reason for complaint. As I pointed out previously in response to an actual question, not everybody who is awaiting IOE is doing so at the Holiday Inn CVG Airport. Most are waiting at home, and everyone should be getting their minimum 14 days off per month, so again, I see no reason for complaint. It's the job - it's what they're getting paid to do. A person could do a lot worse.
Whatever happens, it's not your problem. It's somebody else's problem. Don't worry about it.
I don't have a problem with questions. I do have a problem with whining. Sure, CVG may not be anybody's favorite place to be. But when the company is paying you to be available in a scheduled availability period and paying for a hotel room to do it, I see no reason for complaint. As I pointed out previously in response to an actual question, not everybody who is awaiting IOE is doing so at the Holiday Inn CVG Airport. Most are waiting at home, and everyone should be getting their minimum 14 days off per month, so again, I see no reason for complaint. It's the job - it's what they're getting paid to do. A person could do a lot worse.
Probably right since I have talked to pilots from both outfits. However, if you guys would just quit the personal attacks somebody could make an informed decision.
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