Then this will be perfect for you if you live local. Can make a decent wage with fairly good work rules and be home quite a bit. Living local as a capt it is possible to be home 17-20 days a month and right now as an FO even more than that (especially trading trips to FO's who want to fly).

 

Multi-part reply.

The info on ABX wages and expectations as posted are on spot. Personally I do not count items such as per diem in wage calculations. You will have slight differences in all areas of salary computations based on your tax bracket (wife income, other investments, etc.), and how much OT you can (or care to..) get. Proverbs will properly say plan to live on your base salary. Best of luck with your decision.

On another subject, the grievance regarding LDS training (not pay) was denied. I was initially informed they were going to settle...but clearly that's not the case; bad info, or lack of follow up, on my part. LDS pay grievance...I understand that will continue its course, just as the training item will through the grievance process.

For hiring, it's already been stated there are differing opinions on why, how long, how many, etc. The facts...ABX is loosing some a/c and subsequent block hours/flying. The rumors...ABX will receive aircraft/flying that Atlas does not get reassigned/award based on some expiry in leasing agreements. Unfortunately the latter is, for now, just rumor. Either this flying will be renewed or moved to others...time will tell.

 

It seems to me that the company (at least the ABX part) is kinda on the way out. Losing flying left and right, very little if any ETOPS flying left, tons of people leaving - including new hires whose training is very expensive and many of whom leave in the first year.

No upgrades anywhere in sight with no company communication regarding this...

Not to mention a huge slew of passenger airlines paying more than ABX does at 'minimum guarantee'. Where minimum guarantee is the most that most Abx pilots can achieve right now because of the strange staffing and no open time/upgrades/lines for many, or a company plan regarding anything.

A 4th year united/delta captain will pay as much if not significantly more than a 12-year Abx captain. 4 year vs 12 year. When taking into account minimum guarantee hours (65 at Abx vs 70+ at delta/united), hourly rate and especially retirement and 401k which is significantly, significantly better at mainline airline.

Long term there's no comparison between the two, ie a united/american/delta and Abx as it currently stands unfortunately.

During the pandemic the cargo airlines did extremely well, like really well, but right now it seems the writing is on the wall and it's not clear... why ABX would be attractive to anyone but the extremely senior and the brand new... who will only stay 6 months to a year *if that* then take the type rating and go to some mainline with a future.

Unless there is some other information out there that the company is still processing... I'm not sure what the future is at abx.
Thanks

 

Soooooo………ABX is on the way out. There’s a lot to dissect in your comment but I’ll focus on the quoted statement. I will also say I am bummed about losing the Trans-Atlantic flying, 3-4 day layovers in Europe were wonderful.

If you want true apples to apples comparison then the second part (retirement contribution )is absolutely correct, but the first part is not so cut and dry. ABX Pilots enjoy 14 hard days off a month. Not 12. If a pilot opts to work 2 more days, most likely at premium pay his monthly credit can be much higher than the 72 at Delta and others for the same number of work days. I’m not saying Delta doesn’t pay more hourly but to focus only on min guarantee as a number is skewed data.

I have found there are two types of pilots at ABX. Those that are happy and those that are moving on which is great for them. For me I personally have the best quality of life I’ve had in 17+ years in this industry. Our work rules are decent, I haven’t missed a birthday or holiday since I’ve been on property (that doesn’t mean I won’t someday) and with smart SAP bidding I can usually get my credit a little above guarantee and still keep 14 days off a month. Is it perfect? No, but there are people that are here for the QOL, the work and soft pay rules, and the People we fly with, not just the hourly rate or guarantee number.

Question, Does Delta/United buy you a ticket home for Christmas Day if you are on a stand over day out of base? I ask simply because I don’t know, and was shocked last year to learn that we do. To many this gesture is huge. My wife said the other day (while discussing whether to start applying to legacies) that she has had more quality time with me in the last 2 years than the previous 15. That statement really got my attention.

I have a friend who left here for a company that promised to show him the LUV, and he was so miserable 3 months off OE that he’s moved on his second major in 8 months. My point is not everyone loves their job no matter how big hourly or min guarantee is.

Will we weather the downturn? Who knows, but for now I choose to enjoy my job here, flying with great people and my excellent QOL I’ve managed to enjoy to date, and if that changes I’ll decide to cross that bridge if/when I need to.

For those curious about ABX by all means if after reading all the info in this thread causes you concern, then find something that is/will be a better fit for you.

Disclaimer: my opinion, my experience and your mileage may very.

 

That’s right - it’s all over but the crying. The writing is on the wall, and it says, “THE END”. So everybody lift your voices as you lament your life choices and wail in unison, “THEY’RE GONNA SHUT US DOWN!”

Just like it was THE END when the ANA contract ended.

Just like it was THE END when the TNT contract ended.

Just like it was THE END when the Aeromex contract ended.

Just like it was THE END when the SAS contract ended.

Just like it was THE END when the Gitmo flying ended.

Just like it was THE END when the Ramstein-Cairo flying ended.

In each of these cases, ABX was summarily SHUT DOWN and its ashes were scattered to the four winds, never to be mentioned again.

It is now THE END because some (extra, always temporary) trans-Atlantic flying has ended. There simply is no more cargo flying business to be had. SHUT DOWN. Ashes. Winds.

It is so much THE END that they’re continuing to hire “for attrition” when we are heavily overstaffed and they could easily right-size the pilot group for the amount of flying we’re currently doing by not hiring for at least another three to four months.

That is the state of the industry everywhere, not just at ABX. There is even movement at some of the the big names as ladder climbers take the first offer they get while waiting for the one they really wanted (or in some cases, apparently, when the first offer isn’t everything they ever hoped it would be). When your goal is to get a seat at Big Name Airline and in a business where seniority is everything, you do whatever you have to do to get the experience needed to get the call, and then you take that number when it’s offered to you. That means that ABX Air, and every other airline not named Delta, American or United, is churning through people at insane rates.

You mean the 18-month upgrades are over and some people might have to wait five years to upgrade like they do in the rest of the industry where they fly widebodies? What a travesty!

I don’t know of anyone anywhere in the history of ever who has made the claim that a career at ABX Air would be as lucrative as a career at one of the legacy passenger carriers.

ACMI is not a segment of the industry that most people aspire to join on a long-term basis. Its appeal is limited to a fairly small number of people whose career goals do not include doing the airline terminal bag drag, those who can laugh at their passenger-carrier friends who complain about “long” four-day trips, and those who don’t spend their time fretting about whether they’re going to be the highest paid on the ramp on any given day. Those who do stay for the long term do more than OK.

The future is that this is ACMI. Change is the only constant. Learn to love it, embrace it, lest your career, and your life by extension, become absolutely miserable.

 

^^^^^^^^^^^ Truth^^^^^^^^^^^^

 

I was googling random stuff about the company and came upon this story:

https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-n...oice-loses-job

Anyone know what came of this?

 

Yeah the guy got his job back with no back pay.

 

Deservingly so, although sucks there wasn't any back pay. I reckon he's retired now. Thanks for the info.

 

So it was settled before a full system board?