Who is going where?
08-12-2007 | 03:38 PM
#41
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,409
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Int'l, As a SFS Captain, I will not be bidding HKG. Although I wanted to, that option was taken away with the LOA. I would've been better off with our current contract. To those that voted yes to help out the guys who did want to go...thanks. There will be one or two SFS Captains who will take it. I'm sure the Captain who already lives and owns a home there will. A couple others have homes and families in Asia. Perhaps they will. That's it. As for the F/O's going over as Captains, that's more plausible. Except of course, those with children.
You seem to imply that because 68% voted for the LOA that there are quite a few thinking about bidding it. I disagree. Almost everyone that I heard that was voting for, were doing so for the benefit of those that did bid it. You know $2700 was better than nothing. Many wanted that added "scope protection" Well, for those thinking about it, do your research(our NC certainly didn't), and bid accordingly. I've certainly enjoyed the flying here in SFS. I look forward to going home.
You seem to imply that because 68% voted for the LOA that there are quite a few thinking about bidding it. I disagree. Almost everyone that I heard that was voting for, were doing so for the benefit of those that did bid it. You know $2700 was better than nothing. Many wanted that added "scope protection" Well, for those thinking about it, do your research(our NC certainly didn't), and bid accordingly. I've certainly enjoyed the flying here in SFS. I look forward to going home.
I agree with you 100% The majority voted for it because the union said to vote for it. If any of them wanted to take the plunge and move there they would have voted against it. It is a giant $hit sandwich and we are all going to have to take a bite of it now.
08-12-2007 | 04:12 PM
#42
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 4,184
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From: leaning to the left
Still strictly up to the company whether they want to pay it or not. And based on the seniority of SFS captains, it is not a senior-junior issue, as the junior Cap there is way more senior than any other WB except LAX. The company didn't need to pay it to get Captains over there, so they didn't.
Doesn't appear as if the MEC has anything to say about it, other than what the amount is if the company pays it.
Doesn't appear as if the MEC has anything to say about it, other than what the amount is if the company pays it.
Uhhh... I would have to argue that "O" could be an amount to disagree on:
6.1.e.iv. If the Company and the Association disagree as to the amount of an FDA bonus, if any, the disagreement may be submitted for resolution to the System Board.
But again, I don't really care. It doesn't matter. We(well, actually yes voters) have taken that daunting decision out of the company's hand. There is no more Section 6.E.1.e.ii., FDA bonus, to dispute.
08-12-2007 | 04:57 PM
#43
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 8,047
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From: 767 FO
Still strictly up to the company whether they want to pay it or not. And based on the seniority of SFS captains, it is not a senior-junior issue, as the junior Cap there is way more senior than any other WB except LAX. The company didn't need to pay it to get Captains over there, so they didn't.
Doesn't appear as if the MEC has anything to say about it, other than what the amount is if the company pays it.
Doesn't appear as if the MEC has anything to say about it, other than what the amount is if the company pays it.
08-12-2007 | 05:22 PM
#44
On Reserve
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: MD-11 F/O
Side note, I expect that our MEC and LEC reps who told us this is such a great deal will now lead by example and bid these FDA's. This LOA was such a "good deal" according to them and that these FDA's will "go senior" - lead by example, guys and gals. If your names aren't first on the list to go, and your names aren't on the bid results as "initial cadre" going on the "adventure" then as far as I and the other "32%er's" are concerned, you have some explaining to do. Oh, wait, now I remember. These are the same people who refused to answer any of the valid and pertinent questions during the "selling" of the LOA, so maybe I shouldn't get my hopes up that any future explanations will be forthcoming, or that any of their names will be on the CDG or HKG bid results.
08-12-2007 | 09:57 PM
#45
Slainge Var'
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 1,530
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From: Zeppelin Tail Gunner
Too bad the "pay jump" will be washed out by the Euro exchange rate and the 40% increase in cost of living. A WB F/O based in MEM, LAX, or ANC will make far more than a CDG NB Capt. But, hey, I expect that everyone who voted yes will be first in line to bid CDG and HKG, right?
Side note, I expect that our MEC and LEC reps who told us this is such a great deal will now lead by example and bid these FDA's. This LOA was such a "good deal" according to them and that these FDA's will "go senior" - lead by example, guys and gals. If your names aren't first on the list to go, and your names aren't on the bid results as "initial cadre" going on the "adventure" then as far as I and the other "32%er's" are concerned, you have some explaining to do. Oh, wait, now I remember. These are the same people who refused to answer any of the valid and pertinent questions during the "selling" of the LOA, so maybe I shouldn't get my hopes up that any future explanations will be forthcoming, or that any of their names will be on the CDG or HKG bid results.
Side note, I expect that our MEC and LEC reps who told us this is such a great deal will now lead by example and bid these FDA's. This LOA was such a "good deal" according to them and that these FDA's will "go senior" - lead by example, guys and gals. If your names aren't first on the list to go, and your names aren't on the bid results as "initial cadre" going on the "adventure" then as far as I and the other "32%er's" are concerned, you have some explaining to do. Oh, wait, now I remember. These are the same people who refused to answer any of the valid and pertinent questions during the "selling" of the LOA, so maybe I shouldn't get my hopes up that any future explanations will be forthcoming, or that any of their names will be on the CDG or HKG bid results.
08-12-2007 | 11:33 PM
#46
Proponent of Hysteria
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,085
Likes: 5
From: "Part of the problem." : JL
Too bad the "pay jump" will be washed out by the Euro exchange rate and the 40% increase in cost of living. A WB F/O based in MEM, LAX, or ANC will make far more than a CDG NB Capt. But, hey, I expect that everyone who voted yes will be first in line to bid CDG and HKG, right?
Side note, I expect that our MEC and LEC reps who told us this is such a great deal will now lead by example and bid these FDA's. This LOA was such a "good deal" according to them and that these FDA's will "go senior" - lead by example, guys and gals. If your names aren't first on the list to go, and your names aren't on the bid results as "initial cadre" going on the "adventure" then as far as I and the other "32%er's" are concerned, you have some explaining to do. Oh, wait, now I remember. These are the same people who refused to answer any of the valid and pertinent questions during the "selling" of the LOA, so maybe I shouldn't get my hopes up that any future explanations will be forthcoming, or that any of their names will be on the CDG or HKG bid results.
Side note, I expect that our MEC and LEC reps who told us this is such a great deal will now lead by example and bid these FDA's. This LOA was such a "good deal" according to them and that these FDA's will "go senior" - lead by example, guys and gals. If your names aren't first on the list to go, and your names aren't on the bid results as "initial cadre" going on the "adventure" then as far as I and the other "32%er's" are concerned, you have some explaining to do. Oh, wait, now I remember. These are the same people who refused to answer any of the valid and pertinent questions during the "selling" of the LOA, so maybe I shouldn't get my hopes up that any future explanations will be forthcoming, or that any of their names will be on the CDG or HKG bid results.
Planker:
Very, very good post. My thoughts exactly.
08-13-2007 | 12:45 AM
#47
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 155
Likes: 0
From: Discombobulated
I see someone beat me to the punch in responding, but they are correct, a pilot can take the current section 6 option. However, the LOA added the "tax equalization" crap that currently doesn't exist. That will cost many pilots money. Unfortunately, that takes me out of bidding HKG. The cost becomes ridiculously unbearable.
08-13-2007 | 01:19 AM
#48
Gets Off
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 688
Likes: 0
From: Nordskog Industries Field Technician
Too bad the "pay jump" will be washed out by the Euro exchange rate and the 40% increase in cost of living. A WB F/O based in MEM, LAX, or ANC will make far more than a CDG NB Capt. But, hey, I expect that everyone who voted yes will be first in line to bid CDG and HKG, right?
Side note, I expect that our MEC and LEC reps who told us this is such a great deal will now lead by example and bid these FDA's. This LOA was such a "good deal" according to them and that these FDA's will "go senior" - lead by example, guys and gals. If your names aren't first on the list to go, and your names aren't on the bid results as "initial cadre" going on the "adventure" then as far as I and the other "32%er's" are concerned, you have some explaining to do. Oh, wait, now I remember. These are the same people who refused to answer any of the valid and pertinent questions during the "selling" of the LOA, so maybe I shouldn't get my hopes up that any future explanations will be forthcoming, or that any of their names will be on the CDG or HKG bid results.
Side note, I expect that our MEC and LEC reps who told us this is such a great deal will now lead by example and bid these FDA's. This LOA was such a "good deal" according to them and that these FDA's will "go senior" - lead by example, guys and gals. If your names aren't first on the list to go, and your names aren't on the bid results as "initial cadre" going on the "adventure" then as far as I and the other "32%er's" are concerned, you have some explaining to do. Oh, wait, now I remember. These are the same people who refused to answer any of the valid and pertinent questions during the "selling" of the LOA, so maybe I shouldn't get my hopes up that any future explanations will be forthcoming, or that any of their names will be on the CDG or HKG bid results.
Somebody quoted Chimenti at some point saying "Don't take money out of those guy's pockets that want to go, vote yes." Well, you took a lot more away by voting this in.
I just want to make sure that all of you YES voters remember the basis for your decision when negotiations come around. "We have no leverage, we'll fix it when negotiations come around," you snivel. I'll remember that. Odds of these deals improving with so many other issues to tackle on the next CBA: 0
I know I don't have to bid it, but I am probably going to because I can make it work. Every bad deal that goes down will be reported, and I expect all you 'yes' men to be thumping your chests come contract time since you now have your precious 'leverage.'
Stored up LOA Result Anger Vent complete.
08-13-2007 | 01:55 AM
#49
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 284
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From: DC10 Captain
I can almost guarantee you that the initial cadre will be almost exclusively 32%ers. Why? Because we wanted to go. Because we are in a socio-economic position to afford it. Because we read the ****ing LOA because we were genuinely interested and realized that it was a ****ty deal so we voted NO!
I know I don't have to bid it, but I am probably going to because I can make it work.
I know I don't have to bid it, but I am probably going to because I can make it work.
08-13-2007 | 05:15 AM
#50
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,424
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From: 757 Capt
This LOA was voted on, there was a grass roots effort that worked fairly aggressively trying to send it back for additional work and $$$, an effort that failed.
The majority of FedEx pilots voted Yes (whatever their rational, they voted Yes.) And, a majority of the FedEx pilots actually voted.
I am not going to walk around with a sticker saying don't blame me, I voted No on the LOA. Nor am I going to walk around with a 32% sticker. I believe in Democracy, even when the vote doesn't go the way I want.
And sorry, can't agree that passing this LOA took $$$ out of my pocket. There were certainly potential $$$ out there. The company could have come back with a better offer if we had voted no. But, they might not have, potential $$$$ gone almost as quickly as they came.
So, we will never know what might have happened, we can fantasize all we want about where we could have been, but when we wake up.....the LOA is still going to be here.
Live in the now.
F.I.D.O.
Forget It Drive On
The majority of FedEx pilots voted Yes (whatever their rational, they voted Yes.) And, a majority of the FedEx pilots actually voted.
I am not going to walk around with a sticker saying don't blame me, I voted No on the LOA. Nor am I going to walk around with a 32% sticker. I believe in Democracy, even when the vote doesn't go the way I want.
And sorry, can't agree that passing this LOA took $$$ out of my pocket. There were certainly potential $$$ out there. The company could have come back with a better offer if we had voted no. But, they might not have, potential $$$$ gone almost as quickly as they came.
So, we will never know what might have happened, we can fantasize all we want about where we could have been, but when we wake up.....the LOA is still going to be here.
Live in the now.
F.I.D.O.
Forget It Drive On
