Excess Bid?
01-24-2009, 06:06 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Window Seat -- Left Side
Posts: 112
Excess Bid?
First off, everyone needs to read the contract to understand their options if an excess bid occurs. Secondly, the union contract admin folks should be able to answer your questions that are specific to your situation.
Hypothetical situation:
Current 727 Captain MEM
Seniority would easily fit in HKG Capt
Seniority would be top 10% in ANC F/O
Excess Bid Choices:
1. HKG Capt
2. MD-11 F/O ANC
No other choices will be listed.
An excess in one seat cannot create an excess in an FDA crew position. Widebody Capt passover pay will result. No vacancies, so no move.
ANC MD-11 F/O awarded. Pay for my training slot. Excess relocation package is actually pretty sweet. Paid move to ANC and buy my house in lower 48, etc.
When vacancies are posted for HKG -- I commute to HKG from ANC. After a few years of that nonsense, bid ANC Capt. Already living in donicile -- sweet.
NEVER return to MEM except for training. Sweet!
FEEL FREE to pick this apart based on your knowledge of the contract.
If the company thinks $1 million a month (BLG buy-up) is expensive, wait until all the training costs, relocations costs, and passover costs are added together.
Why did I present this hypothetical scenario?
Because PC has implemented short-term cost savings on the backs of the pilots. Bid what you want to fly, you might just get it.
Peace.
Hypothetical situation:
Current 727 Captain MEM
Seniority would easily fit in HKG Capt
Seniority would be top 10% in ANC F/O
Excess Bid Choices:
1. HKG Capt
2. MD-11 F/O ANC
No other choices will be listed.
An excess in one seat cannot create an excess in an FDA crew position. Widebody Capt passover pay will result. No vacancies, so no move.
ANC MD-11 F/O awarded. Pay for my training slot. Excess relocation package is actually pretty sweet. Paid move to ANC and buy my house in lower 48, etc.
When vacancies are posted for HKG -- I commute to HKG from ANC. After a few years of that nonsense, bid ANC Capt. Already living in donicile -- sweet.
NEVER return to MEM except for training. Sweet!
FEEL FREE to pick this apart based on your knowledge of the contract.
If the company thinks $1 million a month (BLG buy-up) is expensive, wait until all the training costs, relocations costs, and passover costs are added together.
Why did I present this hypothetical scenario?
Because PC has implemented short-term cost savings on the backs of the pilots. Bid what you want to fly, you might just get it.
Peace.
01-24-2009, 06:35 AM
#4
Banned
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Window Seat -- Left Side
Posts: 112
Revised Excess Scenario
Since I've never been excessed, let me refine the hypothetical bid:
1. All widebody CAPT
2. All narrowbody CAPT
3. All Widebody F/O -- ANC MD-11 first
etc.
Same scenario as original post?
Hope so.
Others can chime in on their strategies.
1. All widebody CAPT
2. All narrowbody CAPT
3. All Widebody F/O -- ANC MD-11 first
etc.
Same scenario as original post?
Hope so.
Others can chime in on their strategies.
01-24-2009, 06:59 AM
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: 757 Capt
Posts: 2,418
I think it's a good strategy, but, wouldn't bid it if I wasn't prepared to deal with the consequences.
Might result in POP, might result in a move to HKG and stuck there til senior enough to bid back. I think I'd bank the POP if I went this route, with the mindset of maybe having to pay it back if another bid comes along and I don't want to move to HKG
24.C.6.d. If an excessed pilot is denied an award to an FDA crew position, pursuant to Section 24.C.6.a. or C.6.c., (above), and he has insufficient seniority to be awarded or assigned another crew position with the same or higher rate of pay, he shall be entitled to passover pay.
Might result in POP, might result in a move to HKG and stuck there til senior enough to bid back. I think I'd bank the POP if I went this route, with the mindset of maybe having to pay it back if another bid comes along and I don't want to move to HKG
24.C.6.d. If an excessed pilot is denied an award to an FDA crew position, pursuant to Section 24.C.6.a. or C.6.c., (above), and he has insufficient seniority to be awarded or assigned another crew position with the same or higher rate of pay, he shall be entitled to passover pay.
01-24-2009, 07:20 AM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 357
The problem I see with your scenario is; why would the company even list HKG and ANC as options if they are concerned about the cost.
Like your scenario says, limit the choices. If MEM is the over-manned base, only list excess options at MEM.
You talk like we somehow have a choice in this process. Guess what, the company is not going to do what cost the most. They will do what is the most cost effective.
Like your scenario says, limit the choices. If MEM is the over-manned base, only list excess options at MEM.
If the company thinks $1 million a month (BLG buy-up) is expensive, wait until all the training costs, relocations costs, and passover costs are added together
Last edited by MD10PLT; 01-24-2009 at 08:23 AM.
01-24-2009, 07:26 AM
#8
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: leaning to the left
Posts: 4,184
Originally Posted by MD10PLT
The problem I see with your scenario is; why would the company even list HKG and ANC as options if they are concerned about the cost.
Like your scenario says, limit the choices. If MEM is the over-manned base, only list excess options at MEM.
You talk like we somehow have a choice in this process. Guess what, the company is not going to do what cost the most. They will do what is the most cost effective.
Nice try though.
Like your scenario says, limit the choices. If MEM is the over-manned base, only list excess options at MEM.
You talk like we somehow have a choice in this process. Guess what, the company is not going to do what cost the most. They will do what is the most cost effective.
Nice try though.
His seniority dictates his options.
READ THE CBA!!!
01-24-2009, 07:29 AM
#9
Part Time Employee
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Dispersing Green House Gasses on a Global Basis
Posts: 1,918
Originally Posted by MD10PLT
The problem I see with your scenario is; why would the company even list HKG and ANC as options if they are concerned about the cost.
Like your scenario says, limit the choices. If MEM is the over-manned base, only list excess options at MEM.
You talk like we somehow have a choice in this process. Guess what, the company is not going to do what cost the most. They will do what is the most cost effective.
Nice try though.
Like your scenario says, limit the choices. If MEM is the over-manned base, only list excess options at MEM.
You talk like we somehow have a choice in this process. Guess what, the company is not going to do what cost the most. They will do what is the most cost effective.
Nice try though.
If you are excessed you can bid any seat you have the seniority to hold. The company can't say "If excessed, you can only bid MEM".
01-24-2009, 07:30 AM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Position: let it snow, let it snow, let it snow
Posts: 829
Originally Posted by MD10PLT
The problem I see with your scenario is; why would the company even list HKG and ANC as options if they are concerned about the cost.
Like your scenario says, limit the choices. If MEM is the over-manned base, only list excess options at MEM.
You talk like we somehow have a choice in this process. Guess what, the company is not going to do what cost the most. They will do what is the most cost effective.
Nice try though.
Like your scenario says, limit the choices. If MEM is the over-manned base, only list excess options at MEM.
You talk like we somehow have a choice in this process. Guess what, the company is not going to do what cost the most. They will do what is the most cost effective.
Nice try though.
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