UPS Flight 6 Memorial
09-04-2010, 05:05 PM
#111
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 233
Excellent points Cargoman and Ernst. These guys were fighting with their hands tied behind their backs; they didn't have the right equipment, and they didn't get much of a chance. It makes me really mad...way too much history here to go through something like this AGAIN. In two man cockpits, think of how much time and effort is expended when an unexpected diversion or return to point of takeoff occurs...both guys are busy. Add to this time constrained scenario mechanical problems ...you may be losing electrical buses or autoflight capabilities....and deteriorating environmental conditions of smoke, flames, and heat....
I'd like to see impartial sim studies (Air Safety Foundation, for example) in two man cockpits to determine how much time, attention, and crew coordination it takes to accomplish all essential tasks and how much time is available for firefighting, assuming the cockpit equipment is set up in a useful fashion. Oh, and throw in weather, thunderstorms, icing, IFR approach requirements, and gross weight issues. 16 to 20 minutes to touchdown? Maybe. Is maybe good enough?
As a former sim instructor with thousands of hours in the back of the sim, I have to admit that the smoke / fire drills were too often awkward and cumbersome. They leave everyone with the somber feeling..."I hope that never happens to me" rather than a feelling of confident prepardness.
In any case, by all accounts, we've lost two fine gentlemen, skilled aviators, loving fathers, and cherished husbands. Please let us know when something is set up to help their families.
I'd like to see impartial sim studies (Air Safety Foundation, for example) in two man cockpits to determine how much time, attention, and crew coordination it takes to accomplish all essential tasks and how much time is available for firefighting, assuming the cockpit equipment is set up in a useful fashion. Oh, and throw in weather, thunderstorms, icing, IFR approach requirements, and gross weight issues. 16 to 20 minutes to touchdown? Maybe. Is maybe good enough?
As a former sim instructor with thousands of hours in the back of the sim, I have to admit that the smoke / fire drills were too often awkward and cumbersome. They leave everyone with the somber feeling..."I hope that never happens to me" rather than a feelling of confident prepardness.
In any case, by all accounts, we've lost two fine gentlemen, skilled aviators, loving fathers, and cherished husbands. Please let us know when something is set up to help their families.
09-05-2010, 10:48 AM
#114
Administrator
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: C-172
Posts: 8,024
Kristi Mcgaha-Waters created this memorial on Facebook. There are some very touching things said. Please feel free to join it and add your own condolences and expressions of support for the family.
RIP UPS FLIGHT 0006 | Facebook
RIP UPS FLIGHT 0006 | Facebook
09-05-2010, 02:41 PM
#115
New ride...
Joined APC: Apr 2005
Posts: 534
Originally Posted by nfnsquared
Why are you upset over the reference to PPrune? Were you not aware that HSLD (APC co-founder) already posted the PPrune link in post #14 in this thread:
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/ca...tml#post865407
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/ca...tml#post865407
09-05-2010, 02:52 PM
#116
APC co-founder
Joined APC: Feb 2005
Position: B777
Posts: 5,853
I posted that link within an hour after the report the morning of the accident. The thread posts contained reports from pilots on the ground and in the air near the accident site.
At a time when we were all searching for more info, that thread seem to present some eyewitness accounts rather than relying on AP and other news outlets.
I haven't looked at that thread since I posted the link. If it has become rampant with speculation and innuendo I'm happy to remove the link from APC. IMO, that is clearly inappropriate at this point.
My thoughts and prayers are with all UPS pilots, especially those involved with, or affected by Flt. 6.
Respectfully - HSLD
At a time when we were all searching for more info, that thread seem to present some eyewitness accounts rather than relying on AP and other news outlets.
I haven't looked at that thread since I posted the link. If it has become rampant with speculation and innuendo I'm happy to remove the link from APC. IMO, that is clearly inappropriate at this point.
My thoughts and prayers are with all UPS pilots, especially those involved with, or affected by Flt. 6.
Respectfully - HSLD
09-05-2010, 03:08 PM
#117
Line Holder
Joined APC: Sep 2010
Posts: 85
I removed his link from the Bar and Grill, he did not.
I simply do not understand this man's behavior or why he chooses to be the pariah that he must know that he is.
He received emails and phone calls from the moderators of the B&G and even the EB, yet he figured out a 'clever' way to get around it and have his way - so I simply deleted his link and I will continue to delete stuff he posts if it is against the directives of the EB and the mods.
The wishes and requests of the families of our two lost aviators and friends is all that concerns me and I'm not going to play along with Bob's little games.
I simply do not understand this man's behavior or why he chooses to be the pariah that he must know that he is.
He received emails and phone calls from the moderators of the B&G and even the EB, yet he figured out a 'clever' way to get around it and have his way - so I simply deleted his link and I will continue to delete stuff he posts if it is against the directives of the EB and the mods.
The wishes and requests of the families of our two lost aviators and friends is all that concerns me and I'm not going to play along with Bob's little games.
09-05-2010, 03:23 PM
#118
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Position: UnemploymentJet
Posts: 314
Originally Posted by notadog
I've got news for you. People are going to speculate. There are numerous sites with threads about this accident. PPRUNE is just one of them. Generally, the discussions there are pretty good. (With the exception of the usual Internet idiots.)
Originally Posted by HSLD
.... If it has become rampant with speculation and innuendo I'm happy to remove the link from APC. IMO, that is clearly inappropriate at this point....
1800, sorry about the other issues he's causing for you....
09-05-2010, 04:02 PM
#119
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,235
Originally Posted by Zoso
I removed his link from the Bar and Grill, he did not.
I simply do not understand this man's behavior or why he chooses to be the pariah that he must know that he is.
He received emails and phone calls from the moderators of the B&G and even the EB, yet he figured out a 'clever' way to get around it and have his way - so I simply deleted his link and I will continue to delete stuff he posts if it is against the directives of the EB and the mods.
The wishes and requests of the families of our two lost aviators and friends is all that concerns me and I'm not going to play along with Bob's little games.
I simply do not understand this man's behavior or why he chooses to be the pariah that he must know that he is.
He received emails and phone calls from the moderators of the B&G and even the EB, yet he figured out a 'clever' way to get around it and have his way - so I simply deleted his link and I will continue to delete stuff he posts if it is against the directives of the EB and the mods.
The wishes and requests of the families of our two lost aviators and friends is all that concerns me and I'm not going to play along with Bob's little games.
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