ATI CCIA merger
09-19-2012 | 06:43 AM
#181
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 345
Likes: 0
From: Apelo@290
True, the CCIA's CBA leaves alot to be desired, but keep in mind it is CCIA's first union contract. Remember, ATI has been around for much longer than Capital, so naturally you guys have had lots of practice at negotiating. It’s no surprise that sections of your contract are much better than ours, you've had a 20+ year headstart on us.
Everybody knows that CCIA’s low pay, training on days off and no vacation sucks.
But ATI’s contract can be picked apart as well.
1) Traveling to/from work for free and on your days off.
2) A measly 8 days off during a bid period (10 guaranteed days off minus the 2 travel days)
3) After calling in sick for your line, the company can assign you additional flying or to sit reserve during your days off.
Contrary to popular belief, not every Capital pilot is excited about working under ATI's contract either.
Everybody knows that CCIA’s low pay, training on days off and no vacation sucks.
But ATI’s contract can be picked apart as well.
1) Traveling to/from work for free and on your days off.
2) A measly 8 days off during a bid period (10 guaranteed days off minus the 2 travel days)
3) After calling in sick for your line, the company can assign you additional flying or to sit reserve during your days off.
Contrary to popular belief, not every Capital pilot is excited about working under ATI's contract either.
2. Incorrect. You work 16 days per 28 day bid unit. This leaves 12 days off per bid unit which equals 13 days off per calendar month.
There is a provision to have a minimum of 10 days off during one bid unit of a two bid unit bid, but the other bid unit will have to have 14 days off. In no case will you have less than 24 days off in a two bid unit bid.
3. Incorrect again. If you call in sick for a trip you can be assigned other flying for the work days on your bid line. Your days off remain your days off and can only be changed to works days via junior assignment or section D1 of the scheduling section. D1 allows the change in the event of an unexpected change in the trips schedule. Either way you get compensated above guarantee.
If you have any questions regarding the contract and how it works please feel free to PM me.
Last edited by l8fr82hub; 09-19-2012 at 07:05 AM.
09-19-2012 | 07:20 AM
#182
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
Well. I've made my decision. I'm voting YES...
That's yes to recall the ATIMEC. Guys, this is a total set up. These clowns have been working this since January and just discovered what our CBA says exactly one week before the voting is to end and after all the road shows have been done? Really guys?
Their communication has been either nonexistent, incomplete or inconsistent. ALPA and management are working together here. They both have a common goal which does not include protecting ATI crew members.
An arbitrator is not going to give us less than what the company already offered. Why would they do that? It does not make sense.
We need to vote this down so that we can have time to regroup and get some honest, effective leadership going!
That's yes to recall the ATIMEC. Guys, this is a total set up. These clowns have been working this since January and just discovered what our CBA says exactly one week before the voting is to end and after all the road shows have been done? Really guys?
Their communication has been either nonexistent, incomplete or inconsistent. ALPA and management are working together here. They both have a common goal which does not include protecting ATI crew members.
An arbitrator is not going to give us less than what the company already offered. Why would they do that? It does not make sense.
We need to vote this down so that we can have time to regroup and get some honest, effective leadership going!
09-19-2012 | 12:13 PM
#183
On Reserve
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 20
Likes: 0
And its only just started. Welcoming to working for Uncle Joe.
Perhaps dust off the resume and leave. (My Suggestion)
It will only get worse from here on in. In fact much worse.
Show any weakness to this management group and they will feast on you. Prepare to be eviserated.
In making your choices, perhaps it would be best to listen to the group who has the most experience dealing with these cretins.
Would that be Abx or CCI?
Perhaps dust off the resume and leave. (My Suggestion)
It will only get worse from here on in. In fact much worse.
Show any weakness to this management group and they will feast on you. Prepare to be eviserated.
In making your choices, perhaps it would be best to listen to the group who has the most experience dealing with these cretins.
Would that be Abx or CCI?
09-19-2012 | 01:08 PM
#184
New Hire
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
I’m over at Crappy and I voted yes..
The core group of ATI’ers are the same faces we knew when we busted our tails in the BAX system. They are some of the best in the business.
Before BAX died, I recall that we did not want the ABX poison on our seniority list. Mostly because it irked us that they would be paid enormously beyond us. But there was also a concern that if enough of them came over they could potentially harm our union with ulterior motives. Ultimately BAX shutting down prevented the problem on our flight decks… It’s like a missing six pack from the crew room fridge. It just isn’t right…if ya know what I mean…
We were striving for multi contractual gains at Cappy, and now we seem to be fighting to stay employed or from having our substandard contract sub sub standard. If this thing goes through though, and most of us take our licks on the seniority list it's possible to become a power house airline.
Anyway, I respect ATI the core pilot group. If you guys draw a line in the sand so be it..... It’ll be what it is. Sometimes I miss Taco Tuesday….. or was it Taco Thursday….
The core group of ATI’ers are the same faces we knew when we busted our tails in the BAX system. They are some of the best in the business.
Before BAX died, I recall that we did not want the ABX poison on our seniority list. Mostly because it irked us that they would be paid enormously beyond us. But there was also a concern that if enough of them came over they could potentially harm our union with ulterior motives. Ultimately BAX shutting down prevented the problem on our flight decks… It’s like a missing six pack from the crew room fridge. It just isn’t right…if ya know what I mean…
We were striving for multi contractual gains at Cappy, and now we seem to be fighting to stay employed or from having our substandard contract sub sub standard. If this thing goes through though, and most of us take our licks on the seniority list it's possible to become a power house airline.
Anyway, I respect ATI the core pilot group. If you guys draw a line in the sand so be it..... It’ll be what it is. Sometimes I miss Taco Tuesday….. or was it Taco Thursday….
09-22-2012 | 04:11 PM
#185
Line Holder
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
Maybe I can provide some examples:
ABX 12 year 767 Captain $204/hour
ATI 12 year 767 Captain $173/hour
Why does Joe give ATI pilots only 85% of what he pays ABX pilots? Are they only 85% as skilled? Does Joe think the ABX pilots need more money because they probably have more bills to pay? Maybe.
When ABX pilots do commercial travel more than 10 hours international, they get business class or better. Seats that recline into beds, good food, nice booze, other amenities. ATI pilots don't even get coach. They get tickets so bad that they are guaranteed a middle seat that cannot be upgraded. Does Joe have more concern for the comfort of the ABX pilots? Maybe.
Another possibility is that ABX pilots did something called negotiating. The way it works is when one party wants something, they have to give the other party something in exchange. Of course, peeing your pants and reducing yourself to a quivering mass of puss is one technique but there are other strategies available. I think it's interesting that ATI guys are still falling for the "we can't do combi without the merge" technique. Has anyone ever heard of verifying facts? Nope. They just like to trust that MEC. What?
Don't worry. I know a simple exercize that can help.
Step 1. Sit in a comfortable chair and in a whiney bltch voice say "I had to hold my nose but I changed my NO to yes."
Step 2. Stand up. Place your right hand on your testicles. Give em a gentle squeeze. In a clear deep voice say "today. I can be a man."
Repeat step 2 above until the right actions start to happen.
As an extra bonus, after you cast the right vote, take a nice deep breath through your nose an enjoy.
09-22-2012 | 04:44 PM
#186
New Hire
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Maybe I can provide some examples:
ABX 12 year 767 Captain $204/hour
ATI 12 year 767 Captain $173/hour
Why does Joe give ATI pilots only 85% of what he pays ABX pilots? Are they only 85% as skilled? Does Joe think the ABX pilots need more money because they probably have more bills to pay? Maybe.
When ABX pilots do commercial travel more than 10 hours international, they get business class or better. Seats that recline into beds, good food, nice booze, other amenities. ATI pilots don't even get coach. They get tickets so bad that they are guaranteed a middle seat that cannot be upgraded. Does Joe have more concern for the comfort of the ABX pilots? Maybe.
Another possibility is that ABX pilots did something called negotiating. The way it works is when one party wants something, they have to give the other party something in exchange. Of course, peeing your pants and reducing yourself to a quivering mass of puss is one technique but there are other strategies available. I think it's interesting that ATI guys are still falling for the "we can't do combi without the merge" technique. Has anyone ever heard of verifying facts? Nope. They just like to trust that MEC. What?
Don't worry. I know a simple exercize that can help.
Step 1. Sit in a comfortable chair and in a whiney bltch voice say "I had to hold my nose but I changed my NO to yes."
Step 2. Stand up. Place your right hand on your testicles. Give em a gentle squeeze. In a clear deep voice say "today. I can be a man."
Repeat step 2 above until the right actions start to happen.
As an extra bonus, after you cast the right vote, take a nice deep breath through your nose an enjoy.
ABX 12 year 767 Captain $204/hour
ATI 12 year 767 Captain $173/hour
Why does Joe give ATI pilots only 85% of what he pays ABX pilots? Are they only 85% as skilled? Does Joe think the ABX pilots need more money because they probably have more bills to pay? Maybe.
When ABX pilots do commercial travel more than 10 hours international, they get business class or better. Seats that recline into beds, good food, nice booze, other amenities. ATI pilots don't even get coach. They get tickets so bad that they are guaranteed a middle seat that cannot be upgraded. Does Joe have more concern for the comfort of the ABX pilots? Maybe.
Another possibility is that ABX pilots did something called negotiating. The way it works is when one party wants something, they have to give the other party something in exchange. Of course, peeing your pants and reducing yourself to a quivering mass of puss is one technique but there are other strategies available. I think it's interesting that ATI guys are still falling for the "we can't do combi without the merge" technique. Has anyone ever heard of verifying facts? Nope. They just like to trust that MEC. What?
Don't worry. I know a simple exercize that can help.
Step 1. Sit in a comfortable chair and in a whiney bltch voice say "I had to hold my nose but I changed my NO to yes."
Step 2. Stand up. Place your right hand on your testicles. Give em a gentle squeeze. In a clear deep voice say "today. I can be a man."
Repeat step 2 above until the right actions start to happen.
As an extra bonus, after you cast the right vote, take a nice deep breath through your nose an enjoy.
09-22-2012 | 07:17 PM
#188
Line Holder
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
From: Now flying the lite twin.
Maybe I can provide some examples:
ABX 12 year 767 Captain $204/hour
ATI 12 year 767 Captain $173/hour
Why does Joe give ATI pilots only 85% of what he pays ABX pilots? Are they only 85% as skilled? Does Joe think the ABX pilots need more money because they probably have more bills to pay? Maybe.
ABX 12 year 767 Captain $204/hour
ATI 12 year 767 Captain $173/hour
Why does Joe give ATI pilots only 85% of what he pays ABX pilots? Are they only 85% as skilled? Does Joe think the ABX pilots need more money because they probably have more bills to pay? Maybe.
Delta 12 year 777 Captain 235/hour
American 12 year 777 Captain 205/hour
and the poor
United 12 year 777 Captain 190/hour
09-23-2012 | 06:13 AM
#189
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,894
Likes: 4
Maybe I can provide some examples:
ABX 12 year 767 Captain $204/hour
ATI 12 year 767 Captain $173/hour
Why does Joe give ATI pilots only 85% of what he pays ABX pilots? Are they only 85% as skilled? Does Joe think the ABX pilots need more money because they probably have more bills to pay? Maybe.
When ABX pilots do commercial travel more than 10 hours international, they get business class or better. Seats that recline into beds, good food, nice booze, other amenities. ATI pilots don't even get coach. They get tickets so bad that they are guaranteed a middle seat that cannot be upgraded. Does Joe have more concern for the comfort of the ABX pilots? Maybe.
Another possibility is that ABX pilots did something called negotiating. The way it works is when one party wants something, they have to give the other party something in exchange. Of course, peeing your pants and reducing yourself to a quivering mass of puss is one technique but there are other strategies available. I think it's interesting that ATI guys are still falling for the "we can't do combi without the merge" technique. Has anyone ever heard of verifying facts? Nope. They just like to trust that MEC. What?
Don't worry. I know a simple exercize that can help.
Step 1. Sit in a comfortable chair and in a whiney bltch voice say "I had to hold my nose but I changed my NO to yes."
Step 2. Stand up. Place your right hand on your testicles. Give em a gentle squeeze. In a clear deep voice say "today. I can be a man."
Repeat step 2 above until the right actions start to happen.
As an extra bonus, after you cast the right vote, take a nice deep breath through your nose an enjoy.
ABX 12 year 767 Captain $204/hour
ATI 12 year 767 Captain $173/hour
Why does Joe give ATI pilots only 85% of what he pays ABX pilots? Are they only 85% as skilled? Does Joe think the ABX pilots need more money because they probably have more bills to pay? Maybe.
When ABX pilots do commercial travel more than 10 hours international, they get business class or better. Seats that recline into beds, good food, nice booze, other amenities. ATI pilots don't even get coach. They get tickets so bad that they are guaranteed a middle seat that cannot be upgraded. Does Joe have more concern for the comfort of the ABX pilots? Maybe.
Another possibility is that ABX pilots did something called negotiating. The way it works is when one party wants something, they have to give the other party something in exchange. Of course, peeing your pants and reducing yourself to a quivering mass of puss is one technique but there are other strategies available. I think it's interesting that ATI guys are still falling for the "we can't do combi without the merge" technique. Has anyone ever heard of verifying facts? Nope. They just like to trust that MEC. What?
Don't worry. I know a simple exercize that can help.
Step 1. Sit in a comfortable chair and in a whiney bltch voice say "I had to hold my nose but I changed my NO to yes."
Step 2. Stand up. Place your right hand on your testicles. Give em a gentle squeeze. In a clear deep voice say "today. I can be a man."
Repeat step 2 above until the right actions start to happen.
As an extra bonus, after you cast the right vote, take a nice deep breath through your nose an enjoy.
09-23-2012 | 06:14 AM
#190
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,894
Likes: 4
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