Worst Cargo Airlines to fly for (Pay,QOL,ETC)
05-16-2013, 02:28 PM
#151
Da Hudge
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Poodle Whisperer
Posts: 17,473
Originally Posted by 1111
that quote is like a AA bullpen catcher willing to do a Major leaguers job for non union wages....absolutely astounding
stick to discussing your airline and people might care what you have to say...
stick to discussing your airline and people might care what you have to say...
05-16-2013, 02:35 PM
#152
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2012
Posts: 404
Originally Posted by captjns
I was a B727 Cargo Caninous flyer for two years. We were home based and flown into our outstation or sort. While the pay and benefits were not as generous as perhaps UPS or FED EX, it was some of most enjoyable flying. Weekends off, no cabin crew, and no passengers to worry about. Can it really get better than that, other than pay?
In 2005 we operated into KHRL, and parked on the south east corner of the airport. The Court Yard by Marriott van picked us up first. He apologized to us explaining that we had to go to the other side of the airport to pick up another cargo crew. I said no worries, carry on. Now I am sure this was an isolated incident. However the chaps in brown were quite uncivil to the driver, who was a new employee, because my crew was picked up first.
My F/O and F/E just shook our heads in silent listening to complaints how bad “Brown” was. Crappy catering, no personal hotel vans at their beckon call, crappy schedules, to name some. The whining was louder than Rolls Royce Dart engine.
As for those who served in the military, they earned every cent and bit of training provided by us the tax payers and VA. My deepest appreciation.
My goodness, a company that pays a decent wage, provides retirement and medical benefits, more job security than the other supplemental carriers ala EXPRESS NET, CUSTOM AIR, KALITTA II, to name a few, all gone by the way side with many put on the streets. Such as life.
Upon arrival at the hotel, I sent my F/O to the desk to get our keys, and told him my F/E and myself would collect his bags. Continued complaining and no tip from the higher paid men in “Brown”. I gave the driver a good tip, and told him not to worry, not all of us are special needs children.
I guess if things are that bad, and one does not like the color of their uniform, then perhaps rather than ranting on the boards, it’s time for a change of venue.
In 2005 we operated into KHRL, and parked on the south east corner of the airport. The Court Yard by Marriott van picked us up first. He apologized to us explaining that we had to go to the other side of the airport to pick up another cargo crew. I said no worries, carry on. Now I am sure this was an isolated incident. However the chaps in brown were quite uncivil to the driver, who was a new employee, because my crew was picked up first.
My F/O and F/E just shook our heads in silent listening to complaints how bad “Brown” was. Crappy catering, no personal hotel vans at their beckon call, crappy schedules, to name some. The whining was louder than Rolls Royce Dart engine.
As for those who served in the military, they earned every cent and bit of training provided by us the tax payers and VA. My deepest appreciation.
My goodness, a company that pays a decent wage, provides retirement and medical benefits, more job security than the other supplemental carriers ala EXPRESS NET, CUSTOM AIR, KALITTA II, to name a few, all gone by the way side with many put on the streets. Such as life.
Upon arrival at the hotel, I sent my F/O to the desk to get our keys, and told him my F/E and myself would collect his bags. Continued complaining and no tip from the higher paid men in “Brown”. I gave the driver a good tip, and told him not to worry, not all of us are special needs children.
I guess if things are that bad, and one does not like the color of their uniform, then perhaps rather than ranting on the boards, it’s time for a change of venue.
05-16-2013, 02:38 PM
#153
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2012
Posts: 404
Originally Posted by Lab Rat
I agree. Here is my $0.02 on the topic. Regardless of where you work it is a JOB - from the crappiest bottom-feeder carriers (been there) to the very best carriers (currently there and not taking it for granted). For what it's worth I don't come to work to get ataboys, hugs, and pats on the back - I come to work to offer my skill set in exchange for wages and benefits that I believe are worth my time and effort. I do my job to the very best of the my abilities because that is what they are paying me to do. Do I enjoy what I do? Yes, but that is a bonus and not the reason I come to work. I would venture to guess that these sentiments are shared by the majority of working stiffs in just about every career out there regardless of how much they love or don't love their chosen profession.
05-16-2013, 02:52 PM
#154
Where's my Mai Tai?
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Position: fins to the left, fins to the right
Posts: 1,734
I don't think any of the UPS guys are saying they have the worst job. We just want/expect it to be better. If you guys think UPS/FedEx is the Taj Mahal, wouldn't you want us to continually make it better? If you're pi$$ed we post in the wrong thread, well...
As a side note, when I was working for one of those supplemental/non union/no contract companies in the late 90s, I talked to a UPS pilot (former Cappy) who infact said it was the worst job he ever had. The only thing good he had to say was the checks were bigger and never bounced.
As a side note, when I was working for one of those supplemental/non union/no contract companies in the late 90s, I talked to a UPS pilot (former Cappy) who infact said it was the worst job he ever had. The only thing good he had to say was the checks were bigger and never bounced.
05-16-2013, 02:53 PM
#155
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: Standing in front of the tank with a shopping bag
Posts: 918
Come again?
1111,
You obviously didn't understand what I wrote in my post as I said I had nothing but respect for our veterans. And I appreciate the lesson on Forward Air Controllers. Were you a FAC or served in Afghanistan? If so, that's really cool and I know every one on here appreciates your sacrifice, especially me. Remember I am the one who defended the Decorated Veteran former D.O. Of USAJet from the UPS pilot who just assumed he was better than all other forms of freight trash, and if you aint't UPS, you ain't....
For the record, I compared the life of ONE retired military pilot (Not a FAC, a C141 driver) from the Waterford Place crashpad in 1999 to hooking up with Christy Brinkley (Imperfect, but still COMPARATIVELY beautiful) to flying at UPS, where Christy was HIS only reference. He didn't know Rosanne even existed when he left UPS. Again, not a bad guy justa guy that would be in Ghana, complaining about the drinking water in America to kids drinking dirty water out of a filthy, polluted stream. Delightfully obtuse and clueless, much like the UPS pilots here that consider UPS the worst pay, QOL, etc. out there. It's hilarious, really
!
So let's get back to the title of this thread, and how UPS is the worst cargo airline to fly for with regad to pay, benefits, QOL, etc. Logic defies this entire thread which was about crappy cargo carriers, not legacy carriers with mean Management and FQS's. This is fascinating.... Where's Salty Dog when you need him? Lol...
You obviously didn't understand what I wrote in my post as I said I had nothing but respect for our veterans. And I appreciate the lesson on Forward Air Controllers. Were you a FAC or served in Afghanistan? If so, that's really cool and I know every one on here appreciates your sacrifice, especially me. Remember I am the one who defended the Decorated Veteran former D.O. Of USAJet from the UPS pilot who just assumed he was better than all other forms of freight trash, and if you aint't UPS, you ain't....
For the record, I compared the life of ONE retired military pilot (Not a FAC, a C141 driver) from the Waterford Place crashpad in 1999 to hooking up with Christy Brinkley (Imperfect, but still COMPARATIVELY beautiful) to flying at UPS, where Christy was HIS only reference. He didn't know Rosanne even existed when he left UPS. Again, not a bad guy justa guy that would be in Ghana, complaining about the drinking water in America to kids drinking dirty water out of a filthy, polluted stream. Delightfully obtuse and clueless, much like the UPS pilots here that consider UPS the worst pay, QOL, etc. out there. It's hilarious, really
!So let's get back to the title of this thread, and how UPS is the worst cargo airline to fly for with regad to pay, benefits, QOL, etc. Logic defies this entire thread which was about crappy cargo carriers, not legacy carriers with mean Management and FQS's. This is fascinating.... Where's Salty Dog when you need him? Lol...
05-16-2013, 03:09 PM
#156
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: MD11 Capt
Posts: 34
Originally Posted by B727DRVR
Hi Husker4life,
I had hoped that my description of the retired, decorated Gulf War Veteran, who was the Director of Operations for USAJet, would show my reverence for those who have selflessly served our country.
I had hoped that my description of the retired, decorated Gulf War Veteran, who was the Director of Operations for USAJet, would show my reverence for those who have selflessly served our country.
I was not talking about you at all. I was simply trying to illustrate that us military folks have had our share of rotten deals. I've just noticed some misconceptions about the collective military experience and wanted to bring out my perspective. I think you're dead one with your analysis with regard to this thread.
05-16-2013, 03:32 PM
#157
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: Standing in front of the tank with a shopping bag
Posts: 918
Originally Posted by Swedish Blender
I don't think any of the UPS guys are saying they have the worst job. We just want/expect it to be better. If you guys think UPS/FedEx is the Taj Mahal, wouldn't you want us to continually make it better? If you're pi$$ed we post in the wrong thread, well...
As a side note, when I was working for one of those supplemental/non union/no contract companies in the late 90s, I talked to a UPS pilot (former Cappy) who infact said it was the worst job he ever had. The only thing good he had to say was the checks were bigger and never bounced.
As a side note, when I was working for one of those supplemental/non union/no contract companies in the late 90s, I talked to a UPS pilot (former Cappy) who infact said it was the worst job he ever had. The only thing good he had to say was the checks were bigger and never bounced.
We ALL want things to be better for UPS and Fedex pilots because when 1 group wins, we all win... Well, except those Menlo and Postal deals...
. Everybody is better off when one group raises the bar.Nobody is mad at their IPA fellow aviators posting here, but this thread was started about cargo carriers with the WORST pay, QOL, etc. It's a free country, but it's like the American complaining about the taste of his drinking water to starving and thirsty kids in Ghana. It's amazingly obtuse, out of touch, etc. that ANY UPS pilot would put themselves in the same category as Amerijet.
Finally, most of us have a switch that lets us know when we're clueless. I have caught myself complaining to Regional Pilots and others about some aspect of my job, but have quickly apologized realizing how rude it is to load them up with my problems when I know how much better off I have it than they currently do. That doesn't make me better than them.. Far from it, just luckier. And they will probably be senior to me at my next airline. Timing is everything in this career and our luck is written in ice.
05-16-2013, 05:13 PM
#158
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: B-737NG preferably in first class with a glass of champagne and caviar
Posts: 5,925
Originally Posted by MEMbrain
Like when you were whining about UPS taking "your" Menlo flying when UPS bought the freaking company?
Not the boys in brown's fault for others being put on the street. But perhaps some should look at the bigger picture, and appreciate the fact they are gainfully employed, able to pay the bills, and put food on the table.
05-16-2013, 05:25 PM
#159
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: Retired
Posts: 3,717
I believe that regardless of those who say that the only thing that matters in a job is the paycheck, and that they don't go to work to get attaboys, or BZ's, or friendship, or love, or respect, etc, everyone wants their workplace and the company they work for to: 1) value them as an employee; 2) value their opinion and listen when they have something to say; 3) provide a clean, safe, non-adversarial environment in which they can grow as an employee, and feel that their contribution both benefits the company and is noticed by their employer. 4) there's a number of other things that go into making a company a good one to work for.
That said, and from a lot of personal experience and observation, I believe that if the employee feels that the above "needs" are being met, then they would be less inclined to demand more in the way of pay and other benefits. Of course parity with others in the specific industry, doing like work comes into play, but assuming one is making a reasonable wage and benefit package for the occupation involved in, and at the same time they feel good about their company, and their company is treating them well, they would be much more content than someone who feels that their company doesn't appreciate them, and treats them badly. I firmly believe that's why many of the guys at UPS feel that they are working for a lousy company. It's not always only about the money. However, if everything else is lousy and change for the better is not on the horizon, than it's all about the money to offset all the bad stuff.
That said, and from a lot of personal experience and observation, I believe that if the employee feels that the above "needs" are being met, then they would be less inclined to demand more in the way of pay and other benefits. Of course parity with others in the specific industry, doing like work comes into play, but assuming one is making a reasonable wage and benefit package for the occupation involved in, and at the same time they feel good about their company, and their company is treating them well, they would be much more content than someone who feels that their company doesn't appreciate them, and treats them badly. I firmly believe that's why many of the guys at UPS feel that they are working for a lousy company. It's not always only about the money. However, if everything else is lousy and change for the better is not on the horizon, than it's all about the money to offset all the bad stuff.
05-16-2013, 05:32 PM
#160
Line Holder
Joined APC: Dec 2010
Posts: 42
When you work at a company that:
- gives you fake weather to get you to depart to your destination (magically bringing it from cat III to above cat I)
- tries to fire you for going to your alternate because your destination was well below mins.
- intimidates the mechanics into hiding/not disclosing grounding items to the flight crew
- threatens to fire you if you dont withdraw a grievance
- the CP or DO convince you that you're legal to depart under a given MEL, etc.. and once the cargo is on its way, proceed to throw the crew under the bus by self disclosing to the FAA (and not even telling you to boot).
- or things similar....
THEN you know you're working for a contender for the worst cargo airline to fly for. All while making lower than sub-standard wages.
- gives you fake weather to get you to depart to your destination (magically bringing it from cat III to above cat I)
- tries to fire you for going to your alternate because your destination was well below mins.
- intimidates the mechanics into hiding/not disclosing grounding items to the flight crew
- threatens to fire you if you dont withdraw a grievance
- the CP or DO convince you that you're legal to depart under a given MEL, etc.. and once the cargo is on its way, proceed to throw the crew under the bus by self disclosing to the FAA (and not even telling you to boot).
- or things similar....
THEN you know you're working for a contender for the worst cargo airline to fly for. All while making lower than sub-standard wages.
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