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Quote:

Originally Posted by UncleSam (Post 761706)

In order to flow one must meet the mins for DAL which includes a 4-year degree. Currently DAL is now expecting to hire until late this year if the economy keeps posting gains.

The flow agreement is already part of both the Compass and the Delta PWA. For the people currently at Compass, there is no requirement for a 4 year degree to flow. Only to be a captain and to have been at Compass at least 30 months. The contract would have to be changed in order to change that. The future hiring process can be changed to only hire those with 4 year degrees but if there are any already at Compass without a degree, they already have their ticket to Delta.

Interesting... the Mesaba flow requires us to "meet the minimum hiring requirements for employment at Delta. I know our agreements are slightly different, but I would have thought they'd mandate you at least meet the hiring requirements.

email form Tim today said that the delay of the landing slot swap is going to slow down projected flying for the company. The up side, no LGA base. The down, less hiring and I have to rot on reserve.

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueRidger328 (Post 761850)

I understand the fact that there are very few at Compass without the degree ( have read on this forum the number five once or twice), but I would almost bet money that if the flowthrough was activated in the upwards direction, Delta would not accept pilots that did not have the Delta Air Lines pilot minimums, which includes a 4 year degree. I know that's not in the flow agreement, but I bet that's what would happen, or some waiver would have to be granted to the few that don't have it.

It's really not any different than the NWA guys that are now DAL employees that do not have four year degrees.

Quote:

Originally Posted by obx41 (Post 762010)

It's really not any different than the NWA guys that are now DAL employees that do not have four year degrees.

Yes it is.

Delta acquired NWA. They are not acquiring a company in the event of flowthrough. They are taking on new-hires.

I really never got the big deal with the four year degree thing anyway. I've got 2 undergrad degrees and a masters. I don't think it makes me a better pilot or professional. I have met some real idiots that have specialized avaition degrees. Some of them could barely get a jet in the air whithout kill someone.

I think Delta never liked the idea of flows no matter what the form they took. Now they are stuck with 2 of them and they are a little miffed about it. If they want to change the process going forward fine. Require degrees or what ever you want, its your company now. But don't penalize the people you already have on property.

Quote:

Originally Posted by contrails (Post 761897)

If Delta didn't accept pilots without a four year degree who otherwise would be eligible to flow up a grievance would be filed and Delta would lose. It's very plain language.

If the flow requires the pilot to meet the minimum hiring requirements and DL enforces it, how can anyone think a grievance could hold any merit? Seems pretty black and white... if you qualify and the flow gets to you... and you want to go... GO. If it gets to you and you don't qualify... NEXT.

NWA LOA 2008-01: Mesaba Flow Through Agreement (excerpt):

C. Flow Up
1. NWA shall offer employment to MSA Flow Up pilots in priority to any other pilot candidate for hire, with the exception of a pilot who is eligible for Flow Up from Compass Airlines. Offers to MSA pilots to Flow Up will be made in seniority order, provided that , in order to be eligible to Flow-Up a pilot must:
a. Be a Captain, and
b. Have at least thirty (30) months on payroll at MSA, and
c. Meet all objective hiring criteria and requirements as established by Northwest (e.g., total flight time, multi-engine time, PIC, First Class Medical Certificate, passport, FCC Radio permit, ATP certificate) provided such objective criteria shall not be greater or more extensive than the objective criteria for other new hires. A pilot who does not meet these criteria will retain the right to Flow Up at a later date once he is able to meet the criteria referenced above.

This is why XJ pilots must have a degree, or any other "objective criteria".

The Compass flow through language:

3. Compass Airlines pilots will be offered employment at Northwest Airlines before any other Northwest Airlines Affiliate Carrier or new hires from the street directly to Northwest Airlines.
a. Offers to flow up will be in seniority order, provided that, in order to be eligible to flow up a pilot, must:
(1) Be a captain, and
(2) Have at least thirty (30) months on payroll at Compass Airlines (see Sections 7 A. and 14 A.1.c. for definition of "on payroll"; for purposes of this paragraph 22 D.3., a pilot shall be deemed to be on payroll while on military leave).

There is no third line that says anything about meeting any other criteria as the XJ flow does. This is why NWA (and from what I hear DAL) was/is so heavily involved in the hiring process at CP and not XJ. There are only those above two requirements to flow up from CP.