Go Back  Airline Pilot Central Forums > Airline Pilot Forums > Corporate
Single pilot C560 operations >

Single pilot C560 operations

Search
Notices
Corporate Corporate operators

Single pilot C560 operations

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 10-25-2009, 06:42 PM
  #21  
Gets Weekends Off
 
X Rated's Avatar
 
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: MD80
Posts: 394
Default

Trust me, I've done plenty of single pilot flying in the EMB 145...it's not that difficult.

X
X Rated is offline  
Old 10-26-2009, 10:03 AM
  #22  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Posts: 276
Default

Originally Posted by X Rated View Post
Trust me, I've done plenty of single pilot flying in the EMB 145...it's not that difficult.

X
I guess that means that your F.O. was asleep since the 145 is not certified SP. Touchy subject (sleeping) considering what's happening with the NWA crew.
wizepilot is offline  
Old 10-26-2009, 10:33 AM
  #23  
Gets Weekends Off
 
trafly's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Posts: 194
Default

Originally Posted by Ewfflyer View Post
Maybe it's because I'm a former freight dog, or since I have yet to fly an aircraft requiring a 2-pilot crew(although I have flown as co-pilot in KA's and C421's), but I really don't know what the big stink is about 2-pilot crews on these types of aircraft.

Once again though, how can we judge Zyttoc's skill over the internet? I think we should have a good ole' fashioned Dual of sorts!!! I'm a firm believer that the "TT" is only a partial factor in the equation. Some people make every hour "quality" while others are just there for the ride.
The "big stink" is the extra level of safety that a second pilot brings. When all hell breaks loose, there are 2 guys in the cockpit to handle all the tasks required.

I know that all of us consider ourselves to be competent professionals. However, in an emergency situation, it's far better to have on pilot flying the aircraft and the second running the expanded emergency checks.

Single pilot in a Baron, Navajo, etc, etc,etc... is certainly challenging, and perhaps harder on a day to day basis than a single pilot Citation. But the ultimate goal is safety, and nothing helps that goal more than a qualified, competent second pilot.

Also, let me say that I have nothing against occasional, fair weather single pilot ops. I just can't fathom why folks would operate in all conditions single pilot. Why put a multi-million dollar airplane and passengers lives at risk to save a second salary or satisfy that "I can do it all myself" ego?

Last edited by trafly; 10-26-2009 at 10:37 AM. Reason: read additional posts; had additional comment
trafly is offline  
Old 10-26-2009, 06:22 PM
  #24  
Line Holder
 
MrWalk's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: Palm heel on the throttle quadrant
Posts: 76
Default

Jack Roush does it all the time in his Premier 1.

The OP has turbine time. He's familiar with the ops. He is going to fly the aircraft two-pilot for many hours before taking the opportunity to demonstrate single-pilot competence. He will know whether he is ready or not when that time comes.

After that, he will have to assess every flight against his own skills and limitations and make the decision. He is methodically moving up to higher performance equipment given the opportunity. That is the name of the game.

Safety is important for sure, and all of us as pilots have to have a keen sense of risk management, but, dang, as Pancho Barnes once put it, "See, some peckerwood's gotta get the thing up. And some peckerwood's gotta land the son of a _____. And that "peckerwood" is called a "pilot".

Go, man. Fly high and safe.
MrWalk is offline  
Old 10-27-2009, 06:14 AM
  #25  
Gets Weekends Off
 
X Rated's Avatar
 
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: MD80
Posts: 394
Default

Originally Posted by wizepilot View Post
I guess that means that your F.O. was asleep since the 145 is not certified SP. Touchy subject (sleeping) considering what's happening with the NWA crew.
No, actually many of them had about 500 hours time and were fresh out of IOE. While many were good, many made it feel that I was flying on my own--more so than the guys who had a bit more time under their belts. It's not the ability, it's the mindset.

X
X Rated is offline  
Old 10-27-2009, 02:14 PM
  #26  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Posts: 276
Default

Originally Posted by X Rated View Post
No, actually many of them had about 500 hours time and were fresh out of IOE. While many were good, many made it feel that I was flying on my own--more so than the guys who had a bit more time under their belts. It's not the ability, it's the mindset.

X
Don't mind me. I was just being a little facetious. I know EXACTLY what you are talking about.
wizepilot is offline  
Old 11-09-2009, 08:46 PM
  #27  
Line Holder
 
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Posts: 30
Default

Originally Posted by zyttocs View Post
Thanks wizepilot. I just had to vent and I’m sorry it had to happen in front of everyone. This has actually changed the subject of this post. Maybe it In my case 80% of my time is cross county, 1000 multi, I’ve owned 4 aircraft, I’ve flown 1200 hours part 91 corporate for four companies should have been titled “What makes a competent pilot?”.
in their planes of which 1050 was PIC, 500 TP, coast to coast boarder to boarder, flight levels, and yes I’ve been into Teterboro, Las Angeles, Houston, Dallas, Chicago, and more. I know there are a lot of higher time pilots out there that I can still learn a lot from, but I believe my time has been “quality time”. I have come to know MY limits and work within those limits. I’ll drop it here and move on now that I’ve vented. I hope everyone had a good weekend.
I've flown 421's, 414's and currently fly the Ultra. The Ultra is by far the easiest plane I've ever flown. Very stable and a great intro jet for you. Take it slow, learn all you can about performance issues, and have somebody with Ultra experience sit right seat for as many hours as you need and you'll do fine......congrats on the plane, you'll love it.
xcorporate is offline  
Old 11-10-2009, 04:48 AM
  #28  
No one's home
 
III Corps's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,091
Default

A second pilot is the cheapest redundancy available and in these times, there are plenty of fliers available. It would be in yours and the owners best interest to have someone available when the wx is lousy and you're headed into challenging environments.

It is not a matter of flying the airplane but of doing the brainwork when things get complex. You can put the Citation on autopilot but when an abnormal evolves it can get demanding.

Quite a while back I instructed in Citations and am back flying one. It is a very forgiving airplane and if you just remember 63% N1 you will be back at Baron performance levels.

The challenge will be the first 100-200 hours getting comfortable with the airplane, the environment you operate it in and what it requires. But the Citation is an easy machine to fly.
III Corps is offline  
Old 11-27-2009, 07:22 PM
  #29  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Contrail06's Avatar
 
Joined APC: Aug 2005
Position: B757/B767 Right
Posts: 177
Default

Something tells me that Topgun is the type of guy who sits on the ground and barks about how many hours are in his logbook and "back in my day we needed XX,XXX hours to get a CFI job...blah blah.." Then in flight he would ask me to ask center what the current altimeter setting is as we cruise at FL230.
Contrail06 is offline  
Old 11-28-2009, 05:02 AM
  #30  
Gets Weekends Off
 
Joined APC: Aug 2009
Position: B-757/767 Capt.
Posts: 219
Default

He referes to himself as "Top Gun", is anyone suprised that he is an arrogant prick.
With 22,000 hrs, I'm still a time builder with a lot to learn. My 20,000 hrs in jets are mostly in cruise flight, in the sunshine with the auto pilot on. Who would consider that more valuable than 1000 hrs flying night freight in a Baron, Beech 18 or a King Air? Those are the hours that have my respect! When I was flying PIC in 20 series Lears with LESS than 2000hrs total time I was probably as good as I will ever be.
Time and experience are important but its more about attitude. Zyttocs, yours is great and Top Gun appears to be a condescending bully. Bet he's a blast to fly with.
Zyttocs, I'll put my loved ones on your airplane before top gun's, any day!
CG

Last edited by cubguy; 11-28-2009 at 11:31 AM.
cubguy is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
CANAM
Hangar Talk
116
10-19-2011 09:35 PM
Longbow64
Part 135
117
07-23-2009 08:46 AM
F-90 Driver
Part 135
4
12-31-2008 06:28 PM
TPROP4ever
GoJet
322
11-24-2008 08:45 AM
ksatflyer
Hangar Talk
10
08-20-2008 09:14 PM

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



Your Privacy Choices