We need a plan B for no vaccine.
#411
Its been 41 pages and after many others have told you how it is you’re still a broken record. The vaccine will be available mid next year and eventually the virus will go away due to the vaccine, not because of straight herd immunity. Now you should be happy about this, for whatever reason you’re still rooting against the vaccine. I notice the other pointless thread started about death rates, again it means nothing. It’s dangerous thinking. The virus is still out there and the moment you think it’s getting better it will flame up again.
I am NOT rooting against the vaccine nor have I ever done so. I am stating that we ought to be looking at alternatives to vaccination since history tells us there is no guarantee a vaccine will EVER be developed And even if one is developed, it may be only partially effective and it may take years to get adequate numbers of people immunized to make a big difference.
If you can disprove those assertions, go for it. I won’t be the least disappointed to have my pessimism proved wrong.
Last edited by Excargodog; 09-16-2020 at 02:17 PM.
#412
Nor am I the only one to have such concerns:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...avirus-vaccine
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/2020...x-for-covid-19
https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2020-08-25/what-if-many-americans-say-no-to-a-coronavirus-vaccine
https://www.inverse.com/science/coronavirus-what-will-happen-if-we-cant-produce-a-vaccine
HEALTHCARE & PHARMA
AUGUST 7, 202012:56 PMUPDATED A MONTH AGO
2 MIN READ
FILE PHOTO: Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases, testifies during the House Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Crisis hearing in Washington, D.C., U.S., July 31, 2020. Kevin Dietsch/Pool via REUTERS(Reuters) - An approved coronavirus vaccine could end up being effective only 50-60% of the time, meaning public health measures will still be needed to keep the pandemic under control, Dr. Anthony Fauci, the top U.S. infectious diseases expert, said on Friday.
“We don’t know yet what the efficacy might be. We don’t know if it will be 50% or 60%. I’d like it to be 75% or more,” Fauci said in a webinar hosted by Brown University. “But the chances of it being 98% effective is not great, which means you must never abandon the public health approach
AUGUST 7, 202012:56 PMUPDATED A MONTH AGO
Fauci warns COVID-19 vaccine may be only partially effective, public health measures still needed
By Carl O’Donnell2 MIN READ
FILE PHOTO: Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute for Allergy and Infectious Diseases, testifies during the House Select Subcommittee on the Coronavirus Crisis hearing in Washington, D.C., U.S., July 31, 2020. Kevin Dietsch/Pool via REUTERS(Reuters) - An approved coronavirus vaccine could end up being effective only 50-60% of the time, meaning public health measures will still be needed to keep the pandemic under control, Dr. Anthony Fauci, the top U.S. infectious diseases expert, said on Friday.
“We don’t know yet what the efficacy might be. We don’t know if it will be 50% or 60%. I’d like it to be 75% or more,” Fauci said in a webinar hosted by Brown University. “But the chances of it being 98% effective is not great, which means you must never abandon the public health approach
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...avirus-vaccine
https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/2020...x-for-covid-19
https://www.usnews.com/news/health-news/articles/2020-08-25/what-if-many-americans-say-no-to-a-coronavirus-vaccine
https://www.inverse.com/science/coronavirus-what-will-happen-if-we-cant-produce-a-vaccine
#413
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 534
I am stating that we ought to be looking at alternatives to vaccination since history tells us there is no guarantee a vaccine will EVER be developed And even if one is developed, it may be only partially effective and it may take years to get adequate numbers of people immunized to make a big difference.
None of this will happen here though. You would need unified, consistent leadership (case in point today: Potus vs CDC). It’s got to be a vaccine or we’re truly f’d.
#414
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2019
Posts: 1,538
Here’s your alternative: Taiwan, South Korea, Australia, New Zealand….do exactly what these countries have done. Particularly Taiwan - textbook.
None of this will happen here though. You would need unified, consistent leadership (case in point today: Potus vs CDC). It’s got to be a vaccine or we’re truly f’d.
None of this will happen here though. You would need unified, consistent leadership (case in point today: Potus vs CDC). It’s got to be a vaccine or we’re truly f’d.
All good but the places on that list don't have near the population we have here and don't have a long history of the type of freedoms to do whatever the f*^k we want. The President of the United States does not have the power to do the things you seem to want done. Our country is not homogenous. The states are where medical responses are formulated. All those other countries on your list can simply mandate nationwide measures and they will be done. Not so here.
#415
Here’s your alternative: Taiwan, South Korea, Australia, New Zealand….do exactly what these countries have done. Particularly Taiwan - textbook.
None of this will happen here though. You would need unified, consistent leadership (case in point today: Potus vs CDC). It’s got to be a vaccine or we’re truly f’d.
None of this will happen here though. You would need unified, consistent leadership (case in point today: Potus vs CDC). It’s got to be a vaccine or we’re truly f’d.
#416
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Posts: 534
All good but the places on that list don't have near the population we have here and don't have a long history of the type of freedoms to do whatever the f*^k we want. The President of the United States does not have the power to do the things you seem to want done. Our country is not homogenous. The states are where medical responses are formulated. All those other countries on your list can simply mandate nationwide measures and they will be done. Not so here.
Not for criminalizing but set the example, sell it as a patriotic, tweet nasty things at people who don’t wear masks. Fox news, right wing radio, Republican governors, etc. would follow. Many more people would voluntarily follow CDC guidance. “Freedoms” folks would be seen as selfish, non-patriots.
I’m aware none of this will happen.
#417
From Bloomberg...
Governments Enter the Lockdown Twilight Zone
by
Rosalind Mathieson
September 22, 2020, 5:59 AM EDT
When the coronavirus first raced around the world, many countries opted for hard lockdowns, ordering people to stay indoors, shutting schools and businesses.
We’re now in a somewhat confused Twilight Zone of pseudo or partial lockdowns. Fearful of outright rebellion, and of snuffing out signs of economic recovery, each government is opting for its own hodge-podge of curbs. In some countries gatherings are limited to four, in others six. Some have strict, monitored quarantines, others simply rely on people to “do the right thing.”
Above all, governments are trying their best to avoid a return to the restrictions of March and April. To do so would be to admit failure, that the virus is not only back, but it’s as bad as before. Some politicians are contorting themselves into word pretzels to avoid actually saying the one that starts with “L.”
It’s a tough one for leaders. Even as people object to hard lockdowns — the idea of “big” government interfering in their daily lives — they do want “big government” in terms of spending, access to health care, job support and rescuing key companies. So essentially “small-but-big” government.
And hard choices lie ahead. The northern winter is nearing, and with it the traditional flu season. In the U.K., where workers are being told again to stay home if possible, scientists warn daily cases could hit 50,000 next month. Mass testing in Europe is straining labs and complicating contact tracing.
At a virtual United Nations General Assembly starting today we’ll hear heads of state speak about the challenges of leadership in crisis. What we may not hear, though, is enough talk about collective approaches. Seven months into the pandemic, each country is increasingly going its own way.
by
Rosalind Mathieson
September 22, 2020, 5:59 AM EDT
When the coronavirus first raced around the world, many countries opted for hard lockdowns, ordering people to stay indoors, shutting schools and businesses.
We’re now in a somewhat confused Twilight Zone of pseudo or partial lockdowns. Fearful of outright rebellion, and of snuffing out signs of economic recovery, each government is opting for its own hodge-podge of curbs. In some countries gatherings are limited to four, in others six. Some have strict, monitored quarantines, others simply rely on people to “do the right thing.”
Above all, governments are trying their best to avoid a return to the restrictions of March and April. To do so would be to admit failure, that the virus is not only back, but it’s as bad as before. Some politicians are contorting themselves into word pretzels to avoid actually saying the one that starts with “L.”
It’s a tough one for leaders. Even as people object to hard lockdowns — the idea of “big” government interfering in their daily lives — they do want “big government” in terms of spending, access to health care, job support and rescuing key companies. So essentially “small-but-big” government.
And hard choices lie ahead. The northern winter is nearing, and with it the traditional flu season. In the U.K., where workers are being told again to stay home if possible, scientists warn daily cases could hit 50,000 next month. Mass testing in Europe is straining labs and complicating contact tracing.
At a virtual United Nations General Assembly starting today we’ll hear heads of state speak about the challenges of leadership in crisis. What we may not hear, though, is enough talk about collective approaches. Seven months into the pandemic, each country is increasingly going its own way.
We STILL need a Plan B.
#418
Plan B for airlines is shrink to 50% pre-covid capacity, and stay there for a long time.
#419
The world, obviously. But airlines as well. That shrink 50% - if it occurs - will not be distributed evenly to different business models. Some airlines will disappear altogether if that occurs, and not necessarily the ones many people would expect.
#420
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2020
Posts: 484
The biggest problem is if the world goes to plan B. The airlines are going to plan F as in fail. Plan B will he continue what we have been doing until this thing burns itself out. I am not saying it is a good plan B but it’s the plan we have settled on.
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