Ya sorry but the word of a ALPA generated video isn't enough for me. This is the same ALPA that sold us TA1 and who once said we didn't need to get the pension in our own names...

Some might, but not in this situation. I want to see the so-called changes that suddenly made pensions safe. Again, a video that ALPA created saying so, isn't going to cut it for many.

Just because they didn't go through the cuts, doesn't mean they can't have an opinion on where the capital should be spent. I agree we shouldn't be telling anyone else to suck it up, because we have no idea of the others situation. But simply not wanting a pension is not telling you to suck it up. Resorting to threats of scope/work rules sale is not a good counterargument. Again, if they can negotiate some reasonable safeguards...ie tie our pensions to that a management or pre-negotiate terms in case of future default, then I'm all ears. I like the idea of guaranteed base income, but I hold no ill will toward those who don't want it.

This is an absolute must if a DB were to come to fruition. Having guys work themselves to the bone to artificially inflate their pensions is beyond ridiculous. Having a more easily identifiable amount makes it much easier to predict and fund accordingly.

A bigger issue here is how many guys would retire tomorrow if we got a DB? I'm guessing that would be A LOT. Training is already swamped, can't imagine what this would do to our ability to train people fast enough.

I would say they are TRYING TO GET THE MONEY THEY HAD ALREADY EARNED....

That's not a money grab in my book.

Denny

Soooooo, the DALPA R&I committee is lying to us. Riiiight. You asked for a reference and I gave you one. I can see what ever source I quote will get a similar response.

Denny

I appreciate the video and I've seen it. I'll actually email the R&I committee to ask for the reference, I'm genuinely interested in seeing the change. Again, I'm not against a DB, just cautiously skeptical.

Yeah the R&I committee that haven’t talked about the I of Insurance. What a joke...

There is NO path to a pension. 1) the vast majority of pilots do not want to be screwed again 2) even if there were enough pilots that wanted a pension, during the years it would take to get one back the pro pension crowd voted would all be retired.

No Ponzi scheme. Pay me today for what I do today and when I retire I will be done earning revenue for Delta and they will be done paying me. Fair in my book.

Denny,

Thanks for the civil discussion as always. Glad your Christmas off plan appeared to work. This whole issue is far more complicated than both sides make it out to be and I can see good points on both sides.

I have heard guys call it a “money grap” because the very Pilot who now are demanding we address pensions, voted not to contest the pension termination 14 years ago and now as they see retirement looming they want a pension.

I just dont see it happening. What about all the guys that have already retired? If they are not included it will be .000000001 seconds until the first class action lawsuit is filed.

As far as guys making scrafices at the regional - sorry that does not count at Delta. Just like sacrifices made in the military don’t count, just as sacrifices for a personal business don’t count. The older Pilots at Delta made sacrifices at Delta that directly resulted in PS that all current Delta Pilots enjoy. Sacrfices qmade at a regional, in the military etc may build character but they do not translate directly into gains for the current Pilot group.

So the moral of this story is both sides have valid concerns that should be respected by the other side.

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays all.

Scoop

You guys sold that money for the bankruptcy note. It's gone and not coming back.

Thanks for your help and understanding. 'preciate ya.

Just be sure to say thank you then for the profit sharing that we paid for.