The above is correct. The outside attorney’s we hired for contract C2K were of little to no assistance. The ALPA attorney’s who deal with the NMB and airlines as a full time job did 99% of the work.
I also find that most pilots have no idea how negotiations are conducted. There is no big table where each side tries to outsmart the other. Proposals are exchanged via term sheets which each side takes back and everyone reviews prior to a counter term sheet being issued. The only thing done at the table is clarification of the term sheets. Those term sheets get reviewed by our negotiators, committee for the applicable sections and the professional ALPA negotiators. All work together to draft a response.
The last point is that one of the most critical items in negotiations is costing. The ALPA E&FA team works with all of the above to produce accurate costing for the term sheets. They are considered the best in the world at what they do and are often hired by airline managements to assist in audits and by non ALPA unions in negotiations. Delta rarely if ever disputes their numbers.

 

I think JG's email did not have the effect they wanted it to...I'm guessing now, but I think the pilot group is more united than yesterday morning...

 

Captain LOL ... his email shows how out of touch with the Pilot group he is. Yesterday I was angry, today I am motivated to unify with my brothers and sisters and get the contract we deserve.

The company can stop with the lame ass emails, if they wanted they could've sent us their opener, words mean nothing at this point.

Koolaid drinkers are going to be out and about trying to tell us how DALPAs ask was close to 100 billion dollars over the next three years, losers.

 

I agree. The company skipping to mediation was expected and made me laugh. His email ****ed me off and convinced me to wear our union's lanyard. Also just bid for my vacation in the summer and will not green slip unless it's with conflict until we have a new deal.

We will be unified in no time with emails like that.

 

Oh, JFC, I just read it.
Absolutely laughable.

 

Pretty big QOL gains right there?

You mean, coding iCrew to have a button for sick out/well is that amazing? How hard is it to call scheduling? I don’t like the current system, but this actually HELPS the company (we’ll use less man power when sick). So, I call this a win-win for both groups.

SC paid over guarantee is nice. It will relieve a lot of people of the burden of commuting in and using rest facilities in lounges (and utilizing seats/JS’s on aircraft). This saves weight/$/resources. Likewise, it will result in less sick calls for missed flights/bad weather/etc. It’s a no brainer for both sides and is a win-win.

Commuter paid parking is CHEAP. I have friends whose are commuters who’ve taken parking passes at their base airport just because... even with no car there. I’ve even seen guys sell the passes to guys who don’t get paid parking (SWA), so they actually make money. So, that $80/month at SEA-TAC could be used on $20/month parking in Bozeman, and then everyone wins.

Trip, win-win’s aren’t bad. But let’s not cave to management before we even start.


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As an AA pilot who follows along only for insight on our JCBA you should know even crappy AA has most of what you quote above. Ancient worship here has had clearing sick via automated numbers for years. Commuter parking paid for years. If getting what the number 3 carrier has is what you consider BIG gains I’m scared pattern bargaining could be a bust.

Start a reserve trip on the day before a reserve block and it all pays above guarantee even though only one day was an off day. So please listen to those who’ve been at delta longer and learn before speaking. We all know who you are. You are young and need to learn as you’ve had a beyond quick path to that left seat with some great luck and that’s awesome. Maybe it’s time to let your union do the talking and hopefully you all can set a high bar we at AA and UAL can then achieve and help us all in the future.

 

Some how posting positively about TA'd sections was taken as "caving to management". It's going to be an interesting negotiating period. Thankfully we already have a great contract.

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Just ran across this and would like to add a somewhat different perspective.

I retired several years ago now, but my airline career spanned several airlines, two bankruptcies, and through mergers wound up at Delta. Came from a major whose motto was "The only people we hate worse than out passengers are our employees"; it was an acidic management style, but flight ops was somewhat better treated than other groups. Delta was indeed a breath of fresh air. Yes negotiations are tenuous at best, but you are in good hands with ALPA.

You have to huff and puff and pound your chest to get a fair contract. Its all part of the game but in the long run you will wind up with, most likely, the best contract in the industry. Back in the early 70's a major captain made maybe $45k a year. TWA had an ad in Flying magazine back then advertising for pilots. It mentioned living in great locations and making $1million in your career. Now a half dozen or more line pilots for Delta made that last year!

I have many friends at the other majors and they are all for the most part not happy with their employer.

Getting all upset and ****ed off doesn't really help much. Let your elected reps and the union do their job which they will, and do it well.

We all, well mostly, got into this job because we love flying. Hopefully we will for the rest of our lives. Enjoy the ride it ends quicker than most of us want. Try and not stress out too much. You have the best job in the world in the in your chosen profession.

I probably will get a bunch of flack for butting in here, and I understand that. I wish you all the best in the negotiations.

Himself

 

Great post. To understand exactly what’s going on we need to see our opener. Now that management has withdrawn from negotiations there is no reason not to publish it with the costing data.