Well, I would tell you but FIIK....it doesn't concern me. Some of the things bantered about involve bypassing an AE, seat locks, best way to get out of NYC if assigned, pay protections....and the list goes on and on and on. You will need to get someone who "lives it" to give you some depth of knowledge.....because I am ignorant on the subject(that is precisely my point).......be prepared to spend hours trying to understand "it" and my guess is some of it will be wrong because the rules keep changing.

Suffice it to say, It's complicated.

So those that don't understand these 'nuances' are butthurt. (Your words)


gotcha.

I’ll clarify.

I quoted another poster and highlighted his statement regarding other people. I don’t feel that way at all, which is why I pointed out it was a ridiculous statement.

It was a general statement - not specifically addressed at anyone. Yours was just the most recent post.

Scoop

This sounds like a very reasonable ask.

I don't like the term deadzoner at all. With that being said, one thing people that define as deadzoner have in common IS 9/11.

That event was a watershed moment in our careers and the fallout from it is still being felt throughout the industry. I believe we need to clearly negotiate for pilots on property prior to 9/11. The majority of the pilots hired prior to 9/11 have either been furloughed for more than 5 years and they have also had to bid down to lower paying aircraft and quality of life.

Yes, I like this idea.

I think the time to get this was immediately after the VEOP when we were negotiating no furlough, as part of a more comprehensive LOA. But alas shoulda, woulda, coulda.

this proposal would be more valuable once the MBCBP is approved.

The majority of pilots hired after 9/11 had to stay in incredibly low-paying regional or CFI jobs with no benefits for many years. Or work non-flying jobs just to make ends meet. Or got stuck in the sandbox with the military at less pay and worse QOL than mainline pilots.

Everyone had their own challenges, and we all somehow survived. Carving out part of our contract for one small demographic doesn’t seem very fair.

As a minority, in terms of representing the dead zoners, calling our colleagues, whose vote counts as much as yours, millennials, or telling them to go to their safe space, doesn’t help your cause. Are you trolling, and getting a kick out of their reaction? Or do you really hope to improve your retirement prospects? Cause if you truly want better retirement, you’re going about it all wrong.

Agree. Not a good look for all of his people. I don’t know what this guy is trying to accomplish, but he doesn’t exactly follow the get more flies with honey than vinegar saying.

A keyboard warrior is one thing. I would be hard pressed that this guy would ever be this confrontational and condescending in real life. Easy to do on an anonymous message board though. I feel for the guys who lost their retirement but I also just flew with one of our silver foxes that was taking out a 401k loan with a few years to retirement to upgrade the ol pontoon boat. So the campaigns on the road for sympathy are not run that well either.

Oh yes. Here are some of the things captains have said to me during or right before the pandemic.


"Look at how cool this Tesla is. I can start it with this app." Tesla was $100K.

"Look at this amazing land and house I just got." It was almost $2M.

"I'm thinking about joining this special club. It's $60K to join."

"You should really get one of these e-bikes. I've got two and we love them." Turns out they were $6-$7K each. I could clearly see his LandRover and Porche along with his ginormous house in the background of the picture.

"Look at this boat I'm thinking of buying. I've got another one but this is a wakeboarding boat, so it would be nice to have this one too." Asking price was $60K for the boat.

"Man, I screwed up. I just closed on this house in Tennessee. But look at it! It's got over 40 acres and look at this grass strip!"

"My wife is mad at me again. I've put $1.2M into my business but I know I'll make it back."

"My next door neighbor is Bruce Willis."

"My house in Park City was as expensive as my house in San Diego."

"I've done well in the stock market."

"If I go out on disability I'll make more than I am now."

"Look at this new house that I'm building."


I could go on, and yes these are actual, 100% true things that captains have said to me. I award the deadzoners no sympathy.