It passed.
 

Congratulations to all the Junior pilots on achieving their goals. Too bad about the retro though. For the first time in history, management has every incentive not to come to the table after the amendable date. They’re celebrating.

Everyone didn't get exactly what they wanted? Boo.

78% dude, quit with the inter-generational crap. Plenty of senior dudes vote Yes on this.

How did that full retro in C2015 keep them from dragging their feet today? Show your work.

Agree, the majority has spoken.

well anyways,
the TA passed with 78 percent in favor and 96 of eligible votes being cast.
global scope passed with 90% in favor.

If this logic is true and based on this contract, pilots have equal incentive to never take a concession again.

Thanks for doing the heavy lifting.
-APA

We really dodged a bullet here. March 2020 is about to come back with a vengeance.

Yeah. The concerted efforts to continually lie to FK the only pillar that was of any value to the Deadzoners was a tremendous success. Congratulations

The Deadzoners had plenty of time to be made whole

*Math or reality wasn’t your thing, huh?

The Deadzoners got to fly an extra 5 years

*Assuming I made up the 3.6 million, annuitized value, of the stolen deferred compensation I worked 5 years for free. Yay!

I was stuck at the regionals too long and I blame the Deadzoners.

*We didn’t get a vote on that. Scope sucked for us too.

The pension was frozen, not stolen.

*Only true for a few North West guys. For everyone else, it was turned over to the PBGC. 12 cents on the dollar for me so there’s that.

You’ve had multiple contracts to fix it.

*Working for ALPA for most of the past 38 years, you have no idea of the corruption in place since the bankruptcy.

Just shut up and die you old fart.

*We’re all going there my friend.

I sincerely hope that after a few decades, some unforeseen event doesn’t take place to wipe out the 401k you think you’re saving only to be told by the next generation that you should have planned better. Now go die please.

Do you sincerely hope that?

It didn’t matter because both sides knew they would have to pay. That incentive is now gone.

Nobody. Literally not a soul has wished that on your group. Not a single pilot with a brain would say that or condone those words from a fellow pilot’s mouth, regardless of demographic. You guys arrived to this conclusion through some serious mental gymnastics. If anything this proves there is absolutely no real inter-pilot war on DZers. You just needed a scapegoat.

38 years plus whatever you have left. Dang. I wish I could have that.

How long will it take them to implement SS? I heard a rumor that it might take a year.
Try to get some PB days while I still can.

It's in the implementation MOU

we can! Once Age 70 passes…..which will be ONE DAY after Taildragger1 retires.

really.... this could be interesting to dissect/debate. There was no pay increase for over 4 years. I'll bet management would give you 18% all day long and twice on Sunday every 4 years. You see 18% at one shot, but make no mistake, that IS a concession. Many on here don't see it that way because you are still getting annual raises. The 4,4,14 were a concession vis a vis retro pay. They were signing bonuses. I haven't done the math but I will bet they barely equaled what profit sharing would have been had the plandemic not occurred. When the next black swan arrives, if the majority of the group is at 12+, you will realize that what I am saying is the truth. The next swan will not include the mechanism for UNA. There will be furloughs, there will be displacements, and there will be stagnation. Anyone wanna make a wager on that?

I believe what you’re saying is true, but as a Yes voter open to change my mind I didn’t see a No argument that laid out a road map to realistically leverage improvements. That’s where I believe this TA is very different from the old TA 1/ TA 2

Speaking in absolutes about any such event seems foolish. Early outs and UNA made sense when it wasn’t clear that the government was going to foot the bill and the thinking at the time was that we were looking at an extended downturn of unprecedented proportions.

No one knows what the next black swan will look like or how the airlines will react.

Congratulations Delta Air Lines!!!

In today's difficult environment and historic pilot shortage, you have managed to cost contain and defeat a pilot group that everyone looked up to. This amazing feat sets the trend for the rest of the airline management teams and will serve as a benchmark for continued success of FordHarrison.

Stay tuned for the increased executive compensation and stock awards. You will not be disappointed, and you certainly won't take any concessions.

To Delta Pilots, congratulations on your new, hard-fought contract that you were willing to strike for. Enjoy these fantastic, non-concessionary gains and thank you for everything you do.

So really then, this is more of an indictment of your lack of confidence in the MEC.

I'll give you sunsetting of NFLY as a concession even though 90% of Delta pilots are opposed to anything covid related except free time off.

But name one other concession.

That's fair, and I've actually never looked at it from that angle. I would agree with this statement if another pilot group managed to leverage noticeably more gains on their contract now that we've set the bar. Let's see what our peers put out.

The TA would have had to been voted down by a huge margin, otherwise there is massive incentive for management to drag their feet until more junior pilots come off probation.

Lack of retro pay.

That isn't a concession. And neither is "not getting 25% DC." And neither is "no min balance."

& SWA as well.

This right here tells me all I need to know. I'm genuinely happy for you. May you continue to reap the fruits of your heroic efforts...

And a hearty congratulations again to Delta Air Lines executives and FordHarrison on another very successful conclusion of contract negotiations.

It isn't to you because you are still getting annual raises. To those of us at 12+ years it sure as hell is.

https://external-content.duckduckgo....4bd&ipo=images

And you are right.... going from 25% to zero is not a concession, it is an abandonment.

Not getting something we don't already have but you WANTED isn't a concession.

A concession is giving up something we already had or weakening our work rules.

Come on guys, it's okay if you don't like this TA but at least be honest about what the definition of a concession is.

But you got a raise. Granted it wasn't pensionable, but you're getting a 4% raise in 2020. 10% raise in 22. and a raise starting today with pensionable retro. If you're on one of the banded up fleets, you're getting a significant raise. That's certainly isn't "nothing." You can argue that it's not enough but not enough is not a concession.

And we didn't go from 25% to zero. That's a disingenuous argument. We went from 16% to 18% which, last time I checked, was an improvement not a concession. If we measured contracts based on what we opened with vs what we got, literally every single one would be 100% concessionary.

Retro pay!
filler

Let's see you do better instead of casting stones.

Again. That's not a concession. Try again.

Those are not raises. They are bonuses. Today is a raise based on rates that haven't changed in 4 years. Like I said, I'll bet management would sign a 0,0,0,18% contract every four years in a heartbeat. But yeah, it isn't 'nothing'.

And it is not a disingenuous argument. We get ZERO improvement this year. In case you haven't noticed, many of those that got pummeled in bankruptcy are leaving THIS year. THEY get nothing. But you get yours, so all is good, right?

My God, can we please move on?

It's over.

OK... it is a failure.

You have a lot of bad information and are being intentionally obtuse. They didn't sign a 0 0 0 18. They signed a 4, 0, 10, 4. With all those retirees that retired last year and in 2020 getting their raise as well. And there are improvements this year. There are improvements starting tomorrow and pretty much every month or two through the end of the year. You can be mad that it didn't meet your expectations but you cannot be mad that there are concessions.