Originally Posted by CBreezy

A person running a political campaign for a political office is a politician?! Man. You learn something new every day.

Originally Posted by JamesBond

Not surprising that that is all you got out of that. I'd give anything to come back in 30 years and see if you are still mainlining the koolaid.

Originally Posted by JamesBond

I'm out of here in 2 (hopefully 4) years, so I am not really affected anymore by what the association does (or doesn't do). But... it pains me to watch the same mistakes being made by the membership that we have made over all the time I was here. I almost have to chuckle when I get asked why I didn't vote to fix the retirement issue before when it did (or didn't) come up. It is because I naively trusted what the MEC was saying...that 'this' was the best we were going to get. Frankly that particular thing is both embarrassing and humiliating. Then THIS MEC comes along and states they have a 4 pillar plan/agenda for C19 which included something for retirement for my demographic. Well that turned out to be a gigantic LIE now didn't it? Can you concede that? They. LIED. (And fwiw, I didn't expect a return of a DB pension nor did I really want one. It was interesting that they rubbed arsenic in the wound however by holding off on the DC contribution increases for a year wasn't it?).

Originally Posted by JamesBond

lots of words..

/eor... standing by for incoming.

Originally Posted by CBreezy

I didn't read your whole rant because it just was a rambling mess. That and because your entire premise is backwards. In fact, I'm sure you adamantly support BK and loathe the C44 reps. And the ironic part about that is even in my short tenure, there has been a complete turnover of that council 3 or 4 times. When was BK first elected?

Originally Posted by SideStickMonkey

Calling us noobs help.

That’s why no one listens to you.

Try using some tact FFS

Originally Posted by JamesBond

You hit on a really important issue which is precisely why we need term limits. These reps are politicians. And I will paint with a really broad brush here... ALL of them are politicians. And when (sic) "they aren't kissing babies they are trying to steal their lolipops". Anything they can do to stay in power is what they will do. It's funny that you hear talk about how arduous being a rep is, yet some of them get there and stay forever. Do your own math on that.

That is what over 30 years have taught me. Like many of the young guys on here, when I was younger I was a full on ALPA supporter and I watched contract after contract get negotiated and signed and ALPA would crow about how great the job they did was... only to see happen EXACTLY what is happening now.... right here on this very forum... complaint after complaint about how the company is violating the contract and how this isn't right and that isn't right. blah blah blah. Didn't they crow about how they 'fixed' all these issues and that THIS is the greatest contract ever? The one thing I will say they succeeded at is getting us paid for company transgressions, but I saw relatively little that actually got 'fixed'. ymmv.

I'm out of here in 2 (hopefully 4) years, so I am not really affected anymore by what the association does (or doesn't do). But... it pains me to watch the same mistakes being made by the membership that we have made over all the time I was here. I almost have to chuckle when I get asked why I didn't vote to fix the retirement issue before when it did (or didn't) come up. It is because I naively trusted what the MEC was saying...that 'this' was the best we were going to get. Frankly that particular thing is both embarrassing and humiliating. Then THIS MEC comes along and states they have a 4 pillar plan/agenda for C19 which included something for retirement for my demographic. Well that turned out to be a gigantic LIE now didn't it? Can you concede that? They. LIED. (And fwiw, I didn't expect a return of a DB pension nor did I really want one. It was interesting that they rubbed arsenic in the wound however by holding off on the DC contribution increases for a year wasn't it?).

So I implore you to learn from this. Change the diaper occasionally. Every election preferably. NONE of them are indispensable. NONE of them are so smart or brilliant that the association would fall apart without them. Didn't Hartmann's ARCOS giveback debacle not teach you this? And HE isn't elected by YOU. He has ZERO accountability to the line pilot. That particular thing doesn't affect me on the Panda, but I have read the complaints on here about it. But I'll let the rationalization begin on that. Go to a PUB event sometime at a location NOT in ATL. Count the rep to constituent ratio. They are drinking on YOUR nickel. In the mornings at the MEC, they drink coffee and eat doughnuts that YOU pay for. There's more that I won't go into on here. And lastly, stop using the word 'volunteer' when referring to union reps. They are politicians. They are professionals. What I suggest is changing the bylaws so that should they run unopposed they be allowed to be re-elected. If there is any competition for the seat, they MUST drop out. Go back to the line and actually live under the thing they negotiated.

/eor... standing by for incoming.

Originally Posted by Hotel Kilo

Well, you are. You are new here to this air line. That's a fact.

You call me a boomer, I could give a rats ass. Is what it is.

Originally Posted by Scoop

I also foolishly and naively trusted what DALPA recommended and voted for LOA 46 - you know to keep us out of BK. When we promptly sailed right into BK at 32% lower rates I learned my lesson. DALPA recommended LOA 51 in which we as a Pilot group said we would not fight the BK termination and you know what, the Delta Pilots voted for it. When 100% of us Pilots had a DB we did not fight it. I voted No, the only time ever I voted in the minority, because I was still upset with being played on LOA 46 and also becasue I knew we would never ever get a DB back.

So although I think the current contract slants in favor of the junior demographic I don't feel we can blame junior Pilots for not fighting for the retirement pillar since we didn't fight for ourselves - when every single Pilot on the property had a DB.

Other than throw cash at guys on the way out the door (slim chance) and short of a DB coming back (never going to happen) what really could we have done? Maybe a bridge medical plan? 18% 401K at signing? I personally would have liked to have seen a 6th week of vacation vs faster accrual. This would have benefited the more senior guys and the junior guys would also benefit from it. The time to have fought for the pension was LOA 51 and we folded like a cheap suit. I just don't know what guys were realistically expecting with that pillar. I don't really expect much from DALPA. I submitted an ACE in May and they got back to me yesterday and asked when I called the company to stop my 120 day clock. WTF? Wait over 120 days to tell me I have a 120 day clock - DALPA in a nutshell. Pathetic.

Scoop