I was afraid of that because I actually don't know Denny's situation, so if I offended anyone that was not my intent.

And truthfully I am drawing a blank on the 91 hire's perspective at this moment. Could you remind me of their perspective.

Thanks

 

They aren't at 50 percent yet. 22 years seniority. 500 guys furloughed 3 years.

I don't think you upset anyone. I am just making the comparison that your situation isn't unique. I understand that is not consolation.

For myself, I try to divorce myself from "expectations" and just live within my means and enjoy my trips. Big picture, life is good.

 

Daldude, curious as to your age when you got hired? Thx

 

I was 34 years old.

 

Definitely not unique no arguing from me on that one.

Just got off phone with 91 hire I recognized on seniority list. He put his situation compared to mine better than I could. Here is what he said:

Furloughed for 2 years 8 month vs 6 years 100% longer furlough.

Here is the biggest difference though according to him, he has been a wide body line holding fairly senior FO for 17 years of his 22 vs I will be a narrow body jr FO for 17 years prior to even cracking the top 20% of the seniority list. He then said you will be essentially a new hire for 60% of your career.

It was actually a depressing conversation. I had not thought of it in those terms.

So I guess the 91s are the same as my generation but he seemed to think he had it better. Who knows.

But don't worry I don't pine away for advancement I live within my means and enjoy life.

 

It looks like someone painted us into a corner trying to cost unit bonus monger and it appears they will take it out of planned block hours, if necessary, instead of hire at this point regardless of what happens this year.

 

So I'm on the outside wanting to get in. I, like many others, want to get hired when the hiring resumes. I do understand that the Summer schedule is when the staffing is at it's thinnest. If there are instances now where they are running out of pilots to cover trips what do they do when the flying picks up in the summer?? Try doing more GS? Pull IP's out of the school house, management guys out of the office, cancel trips? I can't understand not wanting to add pilots unless there is a bigger picture they are not saying (more shrinking). I'm not the brightest, but when you bring on a new hire they are essentially the cheapest (hourly) rate that you can cover flying with, right? I would think that would bring the overall hourly cost (average per pilot) down. Am I wrong? Correct me if so. I would think the cost of cancelling flights would far out weigh the cost of bringing on more warm bodies to the front of DAL aircraft.

thanks in advance for shedding the light on this for me

 

Indeed good words scambo. The problem with Internet sport-bi!ching is it doesn't convey a laugh and wink at the end too well. Indeed my situation in life is relatively great to most folks' and I'm happy and thankful for it daily. Enjoy my job and trips both. Live comfortably within means.
All that said I do still like to ensure awareness of what stagnated reality means for guys at the bottom of the pyramid for 12 years. Dalad does put it well (though of course Denny crane isn't the right tgt). My goal is not really complaining it is education and awareness training for TA future voters. I fly with guys ALL the time who say "oh you'll be a capt in 2-3 years we're about to hire like crazy. ". They have no idea what real retirement or possible hire numbers are and they just flat out don't believe me. They're the voting block I worry about. Hey it's a hobby man!

 

I think our profession now places too much emphasis on seniority, to the point we have significant "winners" and "losers" among our pilot group; based on nothing more than the day they were hired, relative to the thousand of others. Anyone hired in the "back of the wave" in an individual hiring cycle has a disproportionately lower career earnings potential, and while this was always true to a degree, the length of the post 9/11 lost decade has really amplified the normal effect of this.

But good luck trying to get a majority of pilots to agree with that, and actually formulate changes to mitigate it....

 

After I got hired about 1700 were hired after me. Then they furloughed 540 after Mo Ron did his ego fulfilling furlough in 92. I sat on the right seat of the 88 for five years then got 727B in 95. Went to the Training Dept as a 727B instructor and got my rating. Went back to the line as a 727A in NYC (those were my most fun years at DAL, sometimes with2 new hires to keep me out of trouble). Moved to 73NA after that, then backpedalled to the left seat of the 88. Went back to 73NA, the ERA in NYC. I have been blessed and couldn't even start to fathom how the "lost generation" feels even though I fly with many of them. It really has been a doo doo sandwich for them. This career is such a crap shoot, and a roll of the dice. If I had accepted an earlier class at NWA I would have been about 1500 numbers junior now. So go figure. My hat goes off to the lost generation because most of them show up for work with a great attitude.