Seems us knocking it out early and ahead of aa ual wud put the greater preasure on our competition.

Agreed but Ed is trying to keep us from “knocking it out of the park” to keep costs down. Waiting for UAL and AA is his way of making sure we DON’T knock it out of the park or it makes it that much more difficult to do so.

Denny

I think this could go either way. If we go first and "knock it outta the park", sure our costs will go up. However, if UAL and AA don't follow suit with a "me too" contract, their labor strife and lack of "competitiveness" will self fund Delta's new contract.

If AA and UAL go first(they have less bargaining power) we may not like our starting position.....however they are already more radicalized then we are(which helps us) and they have seen how voting a TA down helps to raise the bar.

I'm hoping they go first....vote it down, thereby establishing unacceptable parameters, and we come in behind(with a wind at our back) due to our outstanding revenue numbers

Not sure I understand all this "talk" about fix QOL, "I'm happy with the pay rates".

I think one point that we have been missing is inflation, which has been historically low. Let's assume that inflation is 3%(pick your own number). so if one is making 200k a year then you would have to make 206K next year to "keep up with inflation" ?..........that is a fool's bet. By the time I pay the taxes on that $6000 increase to "keep up with inflation"....I'm still losing out

Consequently, pay rates must go up by at least 1.35 time the inflation rate(even more if you live in a state with state tax)(CA it's broaching 12%)(and union dues).....for these individuals need to go up about 1.5 times the inflation rate just to maintain status quo with inflation. I suggest that too many pilots look at the $$$$$ increase and say "Oh, goody" and don't really parse out the nuances of inflation COMBINED with tax implications. This is prolly even more true of guys down in years 1-12 where they get longevity raises on top of the annual negotiated pay raise( their manna from heaven) doubles the rate of those who have "graduated high school" (post grades 1-12)

So, IMO, pay rates need to to be paired with scope as the top line priority......far, far ahead of the other "trivial" stuff. Better medical would be nice.....but some don't use the Delta plan so they are "subsidizing" other pilots gains, whereas an across the board pay rate would affect all equally. Same is true of DH/ RR/crew meals etc

Imagine a world where more money won't make you or your family happier...but less time/stress/discomfort at work likely will. That's where some of us are coming from. My own seniority rise and category progression will more than meet my financial needs going forward, even amidst a black swan or two. And yes, I understand inflation.

I won't turn down more money, but it isn't my own priority any more than improved DH might be for someone else. To each their own.

Actually, it’s hard for me to imagine a world where more money doesn’t buy most QOL issues. Positive space for vacay? More money and I’ll buy my own tickets if I choose to travel. Better medical deductibles? More money and poof, it’s taken care of. Don’t use Delta’s medical plans- - - use the money as you see fit. In a category where you deadhead? Make an option to pay for an upgrade to a window or an aisle or business or 1st if available....more money and done. Think you work too many hours? More money and throw them on the icrew swap board. Rarely see a “just pick up” that doesn’t get picked up. Unless or course coverage is tight and they don’t pick up the straight time hoping for the green.

Remember years ago when the company offered crew meals? No? If I remember correctly, one iteration was you could order a crew meal...only catch being that they deducted a pro rata share out of you per diem......Nobody (or almost nobody) availed themselves of that opportunity in the name of safety......it was all about the benjamins

Since we have a “mature contract”, most gains outside of pay will entail one group “subsidizing” another’s groups gains. Scope and pay are two areas that mostly avoid that.

I am certainly not saying don’t try to improve areas, all I request is that we all be intellectually honest and acknowledge we may be picking winners and losers. No contract should provide a windfall to one group of pilots over another.

I can certainly understand a 3 year new Delta captain might have “enough” money, but there are a lot of pilots that endured the lost decade. That is why we all get one vote.

I’m sure all 3 managements will be happy to drag this out to cool expectations. They will play up any negative news about financial issues and the “slowing” economy. As the end game nears, retroactive pay and other must take it now items will emerge. All 3 contracts will be done in a 6 month period based on who blinks first.

I wonder if the 3yr captain endured the “lost decade,” perhaps in the right seat of an RJ.


Nah, probably not.

Boiled it down for us both. No real need for you to understand my world, nor me yours.

All true - but you're paying for it with after-tax dollars. If it's provided by the company, you aren't paying the 35% or so in various taxes (federal, state, local, sales, etc) to pay for the item.