Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
04-25-2010, 06:41 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Position: 320B
Posts: 781
04-25-2010, 06:56 PM
Looking for a laugh
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 4,099
04-25-2010, 07:00 PM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
This whole discussion of "restoration" vs. "pattern bargaining" is going to be one the key issues facing the MEC in the next few years. When the Delta MEC initiated our plan to gain value from the merger, we saw the next step was to have a strong and profitable enterprise that could afford higher wages. It looks like that is going to play out in the next couple of years. The MEC will face a choice: they can start rebuilding the contract sooner by hitting some singles and doubles, or they can wait and try to hit the grand slam.
Obviously, the APA is trying to hit the grand slam and right now they are striking out. If we are going to short circuit the contract amendable date, then we will probably need to think more about short ball instead of long ball. If we wait until the end of 2012 to get into Section 6, then there will be a tough call between the profitability of the company, which may outstrip their competitors, and the rest of the marketplace for pilots. Pattern bargaining and the marketplace are important, but can an exceptional carrier provide pay and benefits above the marketplace?
Without getting into another fight, the key element is to get everyone rowing the same direction. The MEC will have internal differences within the reps and with the administration. Those differences should be fought but they should remain internal. The days of the scorching council emails have got to stop. The whole KW type poison pen letter has got to stop too. You simply cannot run an effective organization if you are constantly back stabbing each other (see the US Congress, both parties, for examples). Also, my personal opinion is that the former NWA reps need to work on healing the damage their old MEC did during the merger and SLI talks. I am sure that accommodations need to be made from others, but many of the players that initiated these scorched earth tactics are still around and they should take ownership of their actions. This is not a blame game, but it is what we are dealing with and it needs to be taken care of sooner rather than later.
Finally, the MEC will have some really tough choices. There is a lot of anger and pent up demands in the pilots. There may be no way to satisfy those demands. Will they have to courage to actually lead and make the tough calls or will they pander like the APA has been doing and let the NMB send us to the woodshed? These are very difficult questions, but ones they need to start considering now.
Obviously, the APA is trying to hit the grand slam and right now they are striking out. If we are going to short circuit the contract amendable date, then we will probably need to think more about short ball instead of long ball. If we wait until the end of 2012 to get into Section 6, then there will be a tough call between the profitability of the company, which may outstrip their competitors, and the rest of the marketplace for pilots. Pattern bargaining and the marketplace are important, but can an exceptional carrier provide pay and benefits above the marketplace?
Without getting into another fight, the key element is to get everyone rowing the same direction. The MEC will have internal differences within the reps and with the administration. Those differences should be fought but they should remain internal. The days of the scorching council emails have got to stop. The whole KW type poison pen letter has got to stop too. You simply cannot run an effective organization if you are constantly back stabbing each other (see the US Congress, both parties, for examples). Also, my personal opinion is that the former NWA reps need to work on healing the damage their old MEC did during the merger and SLI talks. I am sure that accommodations need to be made from others, but many of the players that initiated these scorched earth tactics are still around and they should take ownership of their actions. This is not a blame game, but it is what we are dealing with and it needs to be taken care of sooner rather than later.
Finally, the MEC will have some really tough choices. There is a lot of anger and pent up demands in the pilots. There may be no way to satisfy those demands. Will they have to courage to actually lead and make the tough calls or will they pander like the APA has been doing and let the NMB send us to the woodshed? These are very difficult questions, but ones they need to start considering now.
04-25-2010, 07:26 PM
veut gagner à la loterie
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: Light Chop
Posts: 23,286
This whole discussion of "restoration" vs. "pattern bargaining" is going to be one the key issues facing the MEC in the next few years. When the Delta MEC initiated our plan to gain value from the merger, we saw the next step was to have a strong and profitable enterprise that could afford higher wages. It looks like that is going to play out in the next couple of years. The MEC will face a choice: they can start rebuilding the contract sooner by hitting some singles and doubles, or they can wait and try to hit the grand slam.
Obviously, the APA is trying to hit the grand slam and right now they are striking out. If we are going to short circuit the contract amendable date, then we will probably need to think more about short ball instead of long ball. If we wait until the end of 2012 to get into Section 6, then there will be a tough call between the profitability of the company, which may outstrip their competitors, and the rest of the marketplace for pilots. Pattern bargaining and the marketplace are important, but can an exceptional carrier provide pay and benefits above the marketplace?
Without getting into another fight, the key element is to get everyone rowing the same direction. The MEC will have internal differences within the reps and with the administration. Those differences should be fought but they should remain internal. The days of the scorching council emails have got to stop. The whole KW type poison pen letter has got to stop too. You simply cannot run an effective organization if you are constantly back stabbing each other (see the US Congress, both parties, for examples). Also, my personal opinion is that the former NWA reps need to work on healing the damage their old MEC did during the merger and SLI talks. I am sure that accommodations need to be made from others, but many of the players that initiated these scorched earth tactics are still around and they should take ownership of their actions. This is not a blame game, but it is what we are dealing with and it needs to be taken care of sooner rather than later.
Finally, the MEC will have some really tough choices. There is a lot of anger and pent up demands in the pilots. There may be no way to satisfy those demands. Will they have to courage to actually lead and make the tough calls or will they pander like the APA has been doing and let the NMB send us to the woodshed? These are very difficult questions, but ones they need to start considering now.
Obviously, the APA is trying to hit the grand slam and right now they are striking out. If we are going to short circuit the contract amendable date, then we will probably need to think more about short ball instead of long ball. If we wait until the end of 2012 to get into Section 6, then there will be a tough call between the profitability of the company, which may outstrip their competitors, and the rest of the marketplace for pilots. Pattern bargaining and the marketplace are important, but can an exceptional carrier provide pay and benefits above the marketplace?
Without getting into another fight, the key element is to get everyone rowing the same direction. The MEC will have internal differences within the reps and with the administration. Those differences should be fought but they should remain internal. The days of the scorching council emails have got to stop. The whole KW type poison pen letter has got to stop too. You simply cannot run an effective organization if you are constantly back stabbing each other (see the US Congress, both parties, for examples). Also, my personal opinion is that the former NWA reps need to work on healing the damage their old MEC did during the merger and SLI talks. I am sure that accommodations need to be made from others, but many of the players that initiated these scorched earth tactics are still around and they should take ownership of their actions. This is not a blame game, but it is what we are dealing with and it needs to be taken care of sooner rather than later.
Finally, the MEC will have some really tough choices. There is a lot of anger and pent up demands in the pilots. There may be no way to satisfy those demands. Will they have to courage to actually lead and make the tough calls or will they pander like the APA has been doing and let the NMB send us to the woodshed? These are very difficult questions, but ones they need to start considering now.
But lets kind of rewrite this slightly for the peanut gallery... dudes, hail marry offense or the west coast offense? Which is wiser for us?
I'm kind of thinking west coast, because thats 2 years to move the ball wherever the opportunity allows vs waiting until the 3rd down on our own 10, 2012, and going 5-wide and throwing deep.
4 months to go. Just 4 months any my wife is giving me an angry look. I think the laptop is about to be thrown out into the rain.
04-25-2010, 07:29 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2009
Posts: 314
If you are off the first day but on reserve the second, my understanding is only the first day is paid above guarantee at straight pay. The rest would go towards guarantee.
04-25-2010, 07:37 PM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Position: 320B
Posts: 781
If it is less than 12 hrs it is not a proffer if you acknowledge the trip (i.e. answer the phone). You have a few contractual outs, but it is not a proffer.
04-25-2010, 08:06 PM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
I'm not 100% sure as far as GS/IA goes, but if a YS trip is assigned inside 12 hours it is a proffer, & you can turn it down. It's black & white in Sec 23.
04-25-2010, 08:11 PM
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
23-3
c. A long call reserve pilot who is inversely assigned a rotation with a report that is within 12 hours of the first attempted contact will receive single pay, no credit for the first duty period of the rotation (in addition to any other pay and credit for the bid period).
Note: Inverse assignment of a long call reserve pilot within 12 hours of report will be by proffer.
This means that you get over-and-above the Res. Guar. for the time flown during the first duty period.
c. A long call reserve pilot who is inversely assigned a rotation with a report that is within 12 hours of the first attempted contact will receive single pay, no credit for the first duty period of the rotation (in addition to any other pay and credit for the bid period).
Note: Inverse assignment of a long call reserve pilot within 12 hours of report will be by proffer.
This means that you get over-and-above the Res. Guar. for the time flown during the first duty period.
04-25-2010, 08:16 PM
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Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Clear as mud??
04-25-2010, 08:20 PM
Doesn't Get Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,598
If your on LC the only way they will even call you for a report less than 12 hours is if you put in a YS or a GS. In both of those cases it would be a proffer and if it's for a YS you get no extra pay and if it is a GS you get paid over guarantee for that day. If you have not put in a YS or a GS and they are calling you it would be for an IA and in that case I don't think it is a proffer. As far as my contract knowledge goes, the only time a trip is not a proffer under 12 hours is if you are on SC or if you answer your phone and admit you are yourself when they are calling for an IA.
Edit Alert....I just noticed that note from section 23 that Johnson quoted and never noticed or cared about that note before. So anything under 12 hours is always a proffer even an IA call if you are on LC. Good tidbit to know.
Last edited by RockyBoy; 04-25-2010 at 08:30 PM.
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