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Old 05-09-2010 | 06:24 PM
  #37291  
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Originally Posted by keenster
We are carrying around on average 7500-10000 pounds of fuel over what we used to land with on the old flight plan system. That adds up to alot of fuel burned to carry extra fuel. Nobody seems to care.
On the 88 fleet they have our arrival fuel down to around 4000lbs now. I even saw one the other day at 3900. That's getting a little to low for my comfort zone. Not sure what is going on with the North fleet, but we don't carry much extra on the -88. Do the North guys do single engine taxi's and shut the APU off yet? Probably save more gas doing that than running on fumes at your destination.
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:26 PM
  #37292  
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Originally Posted by keenster
Sounds like the monthly APA process would work better so management could make changes monthly to aircraft, positions and bases instead of the 3 big AEs per year. They might not have to do such drastic cuts then drastic ramp ups as the world seems to change to quickly for the system in place now. Would that be better or worse?????

I agree with you 110% on this issue. I would love to have the monthly APA process vs the AE stuff we do now.
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:30 PM
  #37293  
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Originally Posted by RockyBoy
On the 88 fleet they have our arrival fuel down to around 4000lbs now. I even saw one the other day at 3900. That's getting a little to low for my comfort zone. Not sure what is going on with the North fleet, but we don't carry much extra on the -88. Do the North guys do single engine taxi's and shut the APU off yet? Probably save more gas doing that than running on fumes at your destination.
I thought 4200 was as low as they could go.... (45 minutes) That was for the aircraft that were adjusted with the fuel low caution light.. the non-modded planes were 5000 lbs instead for the min at destination.
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:33 PM
  #37294  
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Originally Posted by RockyBoy
On the 88 fleet they have our arrival fuel down to around 4000lbs now. I even saw one the other day at 3900. That's getting a little to low for my comfort zone. Not sure what is going on with the North fleet, but we don't carry much extra on the -88. Do the North guys do single engine taxi's and shut the APU off yet? Probably save more gas doing that than running on fumes at your destination.
Good to her you guys are running efficient. Just my point. You see APUs running. Needs to be addressed and they need to be shut down. I see us carrying average 8-10 thousand lbs more fuel than needed, that needs to be addressed and maybe it is in the works. We typically were getting to destination with 30,000 lbs on the 744. That was plenty to get to alternate and never really had a problem in the 20 years of flying them. Landing with 40,000 is nice but what did it cost to carry the extra 10,000. No one wants to be on fumes!
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:35 PM
  #37295  
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We sure as heck run the 767s and 757s dirt low on fuel.... Perhaps the folks at fort widget aren't sure what they can get away with?

And by the way... if there's too much gas and the plane hasnt fueled- we have this device that is called a telephone. I suggest using it. Dispatchers tend to answer.

Also, if it's consistent- are you CORing it? A problem doesnt exist unless it's documented.
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:36 PM
  #37296  
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Originally Posted by RockyBoy
I agree with you 110% on this issue. I would love to have the monthly APA process vs the AE stuff we do now.
Thirded...

APA makes much more sense with as much as we are in flux now.
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:43 PM
  #37297  
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Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
Thirded...

APA makes much more sense with as much as we are in flux now.
It is also quicker to position pilots for furlough because of its perceived efficiency. In reality, the AE system can do the same things but it is a little messier.
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:44 PM
  #37298  
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Originally Posted by keenster
Good to her you guys are running efficient. Just my point. You see APUs running. Needs to be addressed and they need to be shut down. I see us carrying average 8-10 thousand lbs more fuel than needed, that needs to be addressed and maybe it is in the works. We typically were getting to destination with 30,000 lbs on the 744. That was plenty to get to alternate and never really had a problem in the 20 years of flying them. Landing with 40,000 is nice but what did it cost to carry the extra 10,000. No one wants to be on fumes!
To be fair, I think that the new flight plan has something to do with the excess fuel at destination. We're landing with much more than the flight plan projects. I also think the min fuel for departure vs block fuel has something to do with it in that we are somewhat above the min fuel for departure fuel in most cases. I must be going nuts I am posting to my own post.
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:45 PM
  #37299  
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I agree, slow.

I'd honestly prefer something more efficient and that isn't a MOAB once or twice a year.
Old 05-09-2010 | 06:49 PM
  #37300  
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Originally Posted by keenster
We are carrying around on average 7500-10000 pounds of fuel over what we used to land with on the old flight plan system. That adds up to alot of fuel burned to carry extra fuel. Nobody seems to care.
Keenster... You're a north guy maybe you can answer why nearly every FNWA crewed a/c I see parked at the gate has the APU running even if departure time is over 30mins away? Nearly every crew I fly with doesn’t start the APU till they AWABS chime goes off, or 5ish mins prior to push. That's a big waste. Last week at the gate next to us a south 757 was sitting next to us with the APU running, with power and air hooked up 40mins before dept. I bet the CA a NWA crew is flying that plane, b/c it seems they always have the APUs running. So we logged into i-crew pulled the crew names and you guessed it DTW pilots on their way to ATL.

Not only does it waste fuel, but also it makes the walk a round louder.
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