Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
09-28-2010, 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
I don't know...let me ask her. 
Carl
Carl
I KEED!!!!
09-28-2010, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by forgot to bid
Clark Howard “ecstatic” Southwest buying AirTran
9:42 am September 27, 2010, by Rana Cash
Clark Howard is on cloud nine since learning that Southwest Airlines is buying AirTran.
Howard, a consumer advocate and host of his own radio program on AM 750 and now 95.5FM News/Talk WSB says that Southwest’s move into Atlanta’s Hartsfield-Jackson International Airport is a huge bonus for local passengers.
“I am just ecstatic,” Howard said. “It’s like my birthday and my wedding day, the whole thing at once. This is really big. Southwest is the most important player in the airline industry and Atlanta is the biggest airport operation in the country. It’s been so weird that Southwest flies to LaGuardia, but not Atlanta.”
Why all the excitement?
Southwest, which flew only as close to Atlanta as Birmingham, will give travelers more choices to fly at lower fares. In markets where both airlines have existed — Orlando, Tampa and Jacksonville, Fla., for instance — fares are considerably lower than they are where only of the airlines has a foothold.
“The difference in fares is just shocking,” Howard said. “There are a lot of places where you will get a better deal.”
Southwest and AirTran said the new airline will operate from more than 100 airports and serve more than 100 million customers.
Southwest does not beat out AirTran in all areas, though. While Southwest has less expensive flights on shorter flights, AirTran is a better bargain generally for longer flights. AirTran has a more generous frequent flyer program and its credit card is better, Howard said. Southwest, however, has lower baggage fees. It does not charge anything for the first two checked bags. With Southwest in Atlanta, passengers can also expect more destinations.
Atlanta was almost an add-on in the $1.4 billion transaction, Howard said.
“Atlanta is not core to what Southwest is thinking,” Howard said.
The ability to fly more prominently in the northeast, where AirTran has had great leverage, was key to the deal, Howard said. In Baltimore, both have existed, but AirTran has “been bugging the daylights out of Southwest,” Howard said. “Now, they eliminate the flea on the elephant.”
“I’ve been hoping for this day for 20 years,” he said. “Ever since Eastern Airlines went away.”
Question: What do you think of this news? Are you glad to see Southwest come to Atlanta? Do you think you’ll find cheaper flights?
Originally Posted by LuvJockey
1Q 2010
1 Huntsville, AL
2 Charleston, SC
3 Knoxville TN
4 Memphis, TN
5 Newark-Liberty, NJ
6 Houston Bush, TX
7 Washington Dulles, VA
8 Grand Rapids, MI
9 Dallas-Fort Worth, TX
10 Cincinnati, OH 486.31
Lowest average (of top 100 by passengers)
90 San Jose, CA
91 Ft. Myers, FL
92 Las Vegas, NV
93 Oakland, CA
94 Milwaukee, WI
95 Ft. Lauderdale, FL
96 Dallas Love, TX
97 Orlando, FL
98 Burbank/Glendale/Pasadena, CA
99 Long Beach, CA
100 Atlantic City, NJ
Atlanta is #26, Denver is now #78. Denver's average fare is 35% lower than 2001, Atlanta's is 3% lower. In 2001, Denver's avg fare was about $90 higher than Atlanta's, in 2010 it is about $60 lower. That's a relative change of about $150 between the two cities.
Atlanta had 88 million passengers in 2009. Delta had 56%, AirTran had 18%. I can see a reduction of 13.2 billion in Delta's annual revenue over the next few years as long as they disregard the obvious threat to their business that the Southwest Move portends.
1 Huntsville, AL
2 Charleston, SC
3 Knoxville TN
4 Memphis, TN
5 Newark-Liberty, NJ
6 Houston Bush, TX
7 Washington Dulles, VA
8 Grand Rapids, MI
9 Dallas-Fort Worth, TX
10 Cincinnati, OH 486.31
Lowest average (of top 100 by passengers)
90 San Jose, CA
91 Ft. Myers, FL
92 Las Vegas, NV
93 Oakland, CA
94 Milwaukee, WI
95 Ft. Lauderdale, FL
96 Dallas Love, TX
97 Orlando, FL
98 Burbank/Glendale/Pasadena, CA
99 Long Beach, CA
100 Atlantic City, NJ
Atlanta is #26, Denver is now #78. Denver's average fare is 35% lower than 2001, Atlanta's is 3% lower. In 2001, Denver's avg fare was about $90 higher than Atlanta's, in 2010 it is about $60 lower. That's a relative change of about $150 between the two cities.
Atlanta had 88 million passengers in 2009. Delta had 56%, AirTran had 18%. I can see a reduction of 13.2 billion in Delta's annual revenue over the next few years as long as they disregard the obvious threat to their business that the Southwest Move portends.
09-28-2010, 06:34 PM
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OMG, I just posted on the Delta thread. I am sorry, will never happen again - probably.
09-28-2010, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by LuvJockey
OMG, I just posted on the Delta thread. I am sorry, will never happen again - probably.
The reason, btw, that article was posted with the barfing, we're not fans of Mr. Howard here at all and have not been so for many years.
09-28-2010, 06:45 PM
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Any body watching Carl on golf channel right now. What the hell, He could make wahy more money being a caddy than a 744 driver. What's he thinking???????????
09-28-2010, 06:50 PM
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Atlanta is #26, Denver is now #78. Denver's average fare is 35% lower than 2001, Atlanta's is 3% lower. In 2001, Denver's avg fare was about $90 higher than Atlanta's, in 2010 it is about $60 lower. That's a relative change of about $150 between the two cities.
Atlanta had 88 million passengers in 2009. Delta had 56%, AirTran had 18%. I can see a reduction of 13.2 billion in Delta's annual revenue over the next few years as long as they disregard the obvious threat to their business that the Southwest Move portends.
Is that a Clark Howard quote? If it is, toss it to the side, its not worth much. Atlanta had 88 million passengers in 2009. Delta had 56%, AirTran had 18%. I can see a reduction of 13.2 billion in Delta's annual revenue over the next few years as long as they disregard the obvious threat to their business that the Southwest Move portends.
Here is an interesting quote from a usa today article: Opposing view on airline mergers: A bad deal for fliers - USATODAY.com
With the exception of travelers to or from Atlanta*, who in a combined Southwest-AirTran would have a significantly more robust alternative to Delta, there's little reason to think the net effect on consumers will be anything but negative.
The rhetoric deployed to justify the Southwest-AirTran buyout is taken from the same boilerplate used with the Delta-Northwest and United-Continental mergers. Employees, stockholders, consumers and the community at large are all promised outsized benefits, with nary a negative worthy of disclosure.
Indeed, stockholders may be well served by the deal. But that's for exactly the same reason consumers' best interests will be compromised: A reduction in competition will drive ticket prices higher.
While the falloff in travel demand makes it difficult to precisely gauge the cost effects of the Delta-Northwest merger, and United and Continental won't be officially merged until later this week, I have no doubt that when the economy stabilizes and ticket demand rises to post-recession levels, we will discover that average fares have risen markedly.
And taking AirTran, a particularly aggressive discounter, out of the mix will make matters worse, permitting Southwest to raise its prices and eroding whatever pricing discipline the low-cost carriers still exert over the legacy airlines.
It's a vicious cycle for price-conscious consumers, but a virtuous one for airlines intent on hiking fares and boosting profits.---
---
*Whats interesting about the ATL thing, sure there will be sales but its not like AAI didn't do that already. If SWA starts flying ATL-SDF or ATL-MLB or ATL-DAB or ATL-ROA, then it'll bring down the prices but the prices from ATL-BOS or ATL-LGA or ATL-MDW or ATL-MSY are price competitive and AAI and DAL prices are equal. Now AAI, who had a draw down in flights in ATL will have increasing costs.
Now you pick based on experience, first class, FF perks, FF perks allowing you to fly to Europe, seat selection, etc. I think FF's are about to get a huge benefit from SWA coming to town, sure that costs money, but if DAL beats SWA then it'll get interesting in ATL.
Last edited by forgot to bid; 09-28-2010 at 07:01 PM.
09-28-2010, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
I don't know...let me ask her.
Carl
Carl
09-28-2010, 06:59 PM
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Posts: 278
Sorry to break away from SWA/Airtran topic but I have an AE question.
According to the category list for Dec 10 based on the previous AE, i.e. not the Sept one, I should be much higher on the category list then it appears I will be, to the tune of 30 to 40 numbers.
My question is are these projected category lists even close to reality? Will they really convert 30 to 40 guys in one month? Part of the reason I did not bid out of my current seat is it looked like I was getting much senior, but that does not seem to be the case.
Thanks
According to the category list for Dec 10 based on the previous AE, i.e. not the Sept one, I should be much higher on the category list then it appears I will be, to the tune of 30 to 40 numbers.
My question is are these projected category lists even close to reality? Will they really convert 30 to 40 guys in one month? Part of the reason I did not bid out of my current seat is it looked like I was getting much senior, but that does not seem to be the case.
Thanks
09-28-2010, 07:00 PM
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Position: DAL FO
Posts: 2,154
Originally Posted by forgot to bid
It's a vicious cycle for price-conscious consumers, but a virtuous one for airlines intent on hiking fares and boosting profits.
The truth? All airlines (including SWA) are for profit companies NOT public utilities. I just don't get why they are always making us out as the bad guys when we have been subsidizing the traveling public for over a decade. Capacity needs to come down (through fleet reductions or the more recent merger mania) and fares will naturally come up. Airlines need to make money for the economy overall to be healthy. If that means that it will no longer be possible to fly from OAK-FLL for $69 then so be it.
Not picking on you ftb, this just always grinds my gears.
09-28-2010, 07:02 PM
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Position: DAL FO
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Originally Posted by caddis
Sorry to break away from SWA/Airtran topic but I have an AE question.
According to the category list for Dec 10 based on the previous AE, i.e. not the Sept one, I should be much higher on the category list then it appears I will be, to the tune of 30 to 40 numbers.
My question is are these projected category lists even close to reality? Will they really convert 30 to 40 guys in one month? Part of the reason I did not bid out of my current seat is it looked like I was getting much senior, but that does not seem to be the case.
Thanks
According to the category list for Dec 10 based on the previous AE, i.e. not the Sept one, I should be much higher on the category list then it appears I will be, to the tune of 30 to 40 numbers.
My question is are these projected category lists even close to reality? Will they really convert 30 to 40 guys in one month? Part of the reason I did not bid out of my current seat is it looked like I was getting much senior, but that does not seem to be the case.
Thanks
I hear ya. There were plenty of guys that had a % qualifier in that didn't seem to be reflected at all in the actual category list. I'm not sure where they get the numbers when they make that calculation. Hopefully someone will have the answer. If not, call the contract admin folks tomorrow. Maybe they will have an answer for you. They've been very good with any questions I've called with.
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