What scope changes were made in C2K that kept you at ASA 6 years longer (notwithstanding 9/11 and the subsequent recession).:rolleyes:

Great post. I'll withdraw to a correct location should you and ACL choose to move that way.

how about dal farming out the 737 flying along with the majority of the dal domestic feed? maybe he is referring to that.

....he came from ASA and now complains about RJ scope.



And I came from Skywest and I complain about scope. Most regional or ex-regional pilots with half a brain knew that the baby jets we flew were going to screw up our career progression somehow. Hard to fix it at the regional level. We all needed something to put on our resume to get the heck out. Scope needs to be fixed by mainline pilots. Now that ACL is at mainline he can voice his opinion to his peers and maybe something can be done. Isn't the Atlanta MEC meeting coming up soon? Maybe all of us that complain on these boards can go and get some free alpa beer and let our voices be heard. Yes there was FREE beer at the last meeting I went to....OK, not quite free. I paid 1.95% in tax deductible money for the beer.:)

Super, that happened in Contract 96, and I don't remember exactly when ExpressJet became a DCI carrier. We didn't have appropriate scope then. ASA was flying BAE 146's and Ron Allen threatened moving the 737-200 operation (about 70 airplanes at the time, declining to 54 by the time "Sunshine" started) to Comair. To avoid that, we created Delta Express, flown by mainline pilots (mostly recalled furloughees). In C2K we increased the payrates on that airplane, and Express was quickly shut down.

Contract 96 was a terrible deal with a bad result. In hindsight, we were lucky to do as well as we did in POS96. ALPA was a very fractured group in 96 at Delta. There was a substantial movement of non-members (about 1000 guys voluntarily gave back 5% of their pay when management asked), we had about 10% of the list on furlough, and insufficient unity to create a credible job action. Yet the anger that contract generated allowed us to extract a substantial deal from a very profitable company in 2000.

Where do you want to move this?? :)

Excellent post.

It looks like there will be resolutions o'plenty at the upcoming LEC meetings in about every base. Good time to get involved.

Since the union at CPZ keeps us out of the loop, when is the next meeting in MSP. Hopefully it is on one of my 11 days off...

In effect the perfect storm.
Contract C2K changed the manning requirements which canceled my class.
DALPA then changed or loosened scope in 2001 and four other times since then.

Removing the cap on 50 seat jets, raising the block hr cap on DCI from 27-32% to 42% now to 62% of all DAL flying (There is no cap now), Allowing 70 seat jet, allowing 76 seat jets, raising the amount of 76 seat jets allowed, and finally allowing the increased gross weight on the CPZ jets.

I got in during the last few, but the fact is that when I was hired here in 2001, DCI was ASA, CMR and a little SKW out of SLC. That was the extent of DCI. In effect it was no more than 3300 pilots. Today DCI actually outnumbered the mainline group. At the end of DAL hiring in 2008 DAL had 7300 or so pilots whereas there were about 7500 pilots flying under the DCI banner. Where did these pilots on DCI's list come from? Well the paragraph above illustrates it. They are flying routes that were flown by mainline. That is an outsourcing of 4000 jobs. If we were able to hold this line on scope I would be looking at upgrade instead of 10 year at a min in the right seat. That is a huge difference. I knew that coming here but that does not change that fact.

I understand the argument of viability of a route. There are some routes that need DCI, but not all of em. The 50 seat jet is not viable at any carrier, but those 70+ seat jets would make money at mainline. We as DAL, Inc. spend hundreds of millions of dollars a year in margin alone that keep these DCI carriers profitable. That my friends is where our wages went.

I have a unique perspective of this operation. It has grown over the years, I work tirelessly to held educate this group. I enjoy it. Whether you think of me as management or not, it is immaterial. I am here to add to the constructive dialogue on APC. It is a point of view. Anything that is of an NDA nature is left off the boards. I am a champion of our company. It is a great place to work, but it is ok to recognize that the walls might need repainting, or the chairs in the crew lounge need a re do. Point is that I and many other colleagues on here want to improve the quality of the career. I bet that you fell the same way. I am not willing to accept status quo. You should not either. I apologize if somewhere that got lost in the translation.

There will be a resolution on CPZ at the ATL LEC meeting. I urge you to go.