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TOGA LK 11-21-2010 05:46 PM


Originally Posted by Flamer (Post 904805)
All clear except the last part. How can you start 5 hours after rest when you are not contactable during rest? The only way I could see this happening is if it was acknowledged prior to your rest

Let me see if I have a grasp of it?

Coming off an X-day your reserve starts at midnight base time. From midnight, they can place something on your schedule and start the 12 hour window for a trip assignment or they can convert you to shortcall within 10 hours with a 2 hour commuter extension. Your only obligation to acknowledge either a trip or shortcall is 3 hours prior.

On an X-day, all pilots are available for a following day assignment of a trip with a checking of 0500 base time or a RAP as early as 0500 base time. No acknowledgement is required on your X-day (Its assumed you are vacationing and not contactable). When the swing shift arrives, they will typically call you after 1500 base time at some arbitrary point in time to verify that you are aware of your assignment if you have a trip or shortcall. Again, there is no requirement to answer this call or verify an assignment on an X-day (you can and most do in good faith).

After midnight, it gets interesting as you do have a requirement to acknowledge a trip or shortcall by 0200, three hours prior to a potential 0500 shortcall or sign-in. This equates to a duty period that essentially can start as soon as 5 hours following X-day; this is likely the logic that is used to say that an assignment can start as soon as five hours following an FAR 24/7 rest period. Once you roll past 02:00 base time of the first day, your only requirement for establishing contact or verifying a status is 3 hours prior to the event.

From what I've experienced.

While on reserve or a trip and on long call the following day, they will assign an open time trip for the following day early on the morning shift. No one will likely call you until the swing shift, but they will call you three hours prior to the following day assignment. The AM schedulers rely upon the VRU for next day assignments while the swing schedulers may clean up with a phone call if you haven't acknowledged. Once open time for the following day is assigned, if another trip pops up the schedulers will (they always have for me) call and notify you, minimum 12 hours notice otherwise pop ups handled by short call. Some people forget that a long call assignment can come down to you at 21:00 base time (while you are enroute home) for an 09:00 report the following am.... Commuters beware.


There's probably more. The basics are most definitely setup around a reserve living in base.

Bucking Bar 11-21-2010 05:52 PM


Originally Posted by iceman49 (Post 904646)
If you are on Mil leave, do you participate in the profit sharing? Thanks

Just curious... why would they? Pro/Con.

iceman49 11-21-2010 05:55 PM


Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 904830)
Just curious... why would they? Pro/Con.

Have heard both ways, and was wondering which one was correct.

Flamer 11-21-2010 06:02 PM

Toga- thanks.

I'm going to start printing out these and placing them in "when scheduling calls" like bulletins.

I hope our next contract is written by redneck lawyers so I can understand what the f they are trying to get me to do.

TOGA LK 11-21-2010 06:05 PM


Originally Posted by Flamer (Post 904833)
Toga- thanks.

I'm going to start printing out these and placing them in "when scheduling calls" like bulletins.

I hope our next contract is written by redneck lawyers so I can understand what the f they are trying to get me to do.

You are welcome my Douglas brother! I'd forward it to Ken Watts or someone in contract admin just to double check it, it's based upon my understanding and as others have explained to me. Fortunately, there are a lot of smart people lurking these threads, if my analysis is off hopefully someone will chime in.

I've heard changes are coming to the reserve system in the not so distant future once the IT improvements arrive.

forgot to bid 11-21-2010 06:08 PM

TOGA, whats the LK for in your name?

nwaf16dude 11-21-2010 06:09 PM


Originally Posted by Bucking Bar (Post 904830)
Just curious... why would they? Pro/Con.

It's not a black & white requirement of USERRA. I'm sure it's at least partially a patriotism/good will toward the military issue. Legally, I think the biggest reason they will continue to do it is that they have established it as a past practice over many years, and to change the policy would invite lawsuits. I wouldn't disagree if they withheld the payments until the individuals return from leave. No sense giving someone a check that doesn't intend to return.

I really don't understand why Long-term sick is (or has been) treated differently.

TOGA LK 11-21-2010 06:19 PM


Originally Posted by forgot to bid (Post 904839)
TOGA, whats the LK for in your name?

It's abbreviation for TOGA LK (lock), it's an FMA annunciation on Airbus equipment that the thrust management system has applied TOGA in response to alpha floor protection. I picked it bc it is analogous to the industry being at (hopefully) the lowest level and guys (employees and management) working at their best to restore the profession and the industry.

TOGA LK 11-21-2010 06:24 PM


Originally Posted by nwaf16dude (Post 904840)
It's not a black & white requirement of USERRA. I'm sure it's at least partially a patriotism/good will toward the military issue. Legally, I think the biggest reason they will continue to do it is that they have established it as a past practice over many years, and to change the policy would invite lawsuits. I wouldn't disagree if they withheld the payments until the individuals return from leave. No sense giving someone a check that doesn't intend to return.

I really don't understand why Long-term sick is (or has been) treated differently.

AMR was the first airline that the DOJ went after over USERRA violations. Its nice to see that Delta strives to take care of our heros in such contrast.

LOBO 11-21-2010 06:30 PM

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