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I realize this is off topic from scope, but it is contract stuff...I had a UAL guy jump seating from EWR-ATL last night (Friday), and I asked him how the merger was going, as well as the joint collective bargaining agreement. He said that "the rumor we're hearing is the company offered us FedEx pay rates, plus $5 an hour". This, I can only assume, was for the pilots to get their seniority list done, and contract signed. Anybody heard from your CAL or UAL buds on this?
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Originally Posted by Pineapple Guy
(Post 926432)
I disagree. I think this next contract WILL be the contract in which the 100 seat jet comes into existence. With the phase out of the DC9's and DAL's phase out of B737-200s a few years ago, there's a gaping hole in the system with nothing between 76 seats and 125(?) of the A319. That's a huge spread, that needs to be filled, imo.
I think they'll open for the regionals to fly it, and in the end I think we'll fly it, but they'll try to extract a lot of negotiating capital from us to make that happen. Oh they will ask and try to assign great value to it, but the fact is that we would have to play their game to accept that value. We already own that flying. If we sold it for a bargaining credit, we are the fools. |
Originally Posted by sailingfun
(Post 926439)
The company has been stating a replacement 100 seat jet would be ordered in a matter of months since 1991 when the nines were retired. I am not hold ing my breath 20 years later. I personally have heard senior management on at least 3 occasions mention the fact that they can fly a 150 seat jet for almost the same cost as a 100 seat jet. After 20 years I am starting to think that might be their plan.
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Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
(Post 926575)
In our current representation environment, the real worry is that the pilots' REPS will give up something of real value to make it go away. The pilots currently assume their reps understand the importance of scope. I believe the reps do NOT share that concern.
Carl |
Originally Posted by chuck416
(Post 926649)
I realize this is off topic from scope, but it is contract stuff...I had a UAL guy jump seating from EWR-ATL last night (Friday), and I asked him how the merger was going, as well as the joint collective bargaining agreement. He said that "the rumor we're hearing is the company offered us FedEx pay rates, plus $5 an hour". This, I can only assume, was for the pilots to get their seniority list done, and contract signed. Anybody heard from your CAL or UAL buds on this?
Another reason why it would be foolish for us to state any contract demands at this time. I also suspect the company will sit on its hands wrt to us until the AFA vote is done for good. |
Originally Posted by capncrunch
(Post 926642)
I think it is naive and foolish to believe the scope line is set in stone.
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Originally Posted by acl65pilot
(Post 926656)
Carl; Frankly you are a minority. Many of the Senior Captains I fly with are very frank about the fact that all they want is money and they want it now. They only have a few years left and they need as much as they can get to retire. The hold no ill will, but that is what they say. So quit thinking I am slamming you.
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Originally Posted by scambo1
(Post 926686)
I fly with more senior captains than you do. I have heard maybe 5-7% say what your guys are saying. Of course how a person votes in the privateness of his home is up to him. I bring this stuff up every trip, they concensus is without scope we have nuthin.
Let's just use Pilots A, B, C, and D. Pilot A believes Scope is the #1 issue, and states everyone he flies with agrees with him. Pilot B believes Pay is the #1 issue, and states everyone he flies with agrees with him. Pilot C believes DPA is the answer, and states everyone he flies with agrees with him. Pilot D believes ALPA is the answer, and states everyone he flies with agrees with him. How can this be? Unless, as I suspect, we all hear what we want to hear, and pilots who really don't have the passion that we do tend to agree with us more or less just to keep the cockpit cordial. Could it be the only time you really get a reasonably honest answer is Wilson Polling and/or MEMRAT votes? And our elected leaders know the results of Wilson polling and act accordingly, and we all have seen the outcome of MEMRAT votes. Food for thought. |
Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
(Post 926575)
In our current representation environment, the real worry is that the pilots' REPS will give up something of real value to make it go away. The pilots currently assume their reps understand the importance of scope. I believe the reps do NOT share that concern.
Carl Yes, there are several ways that unwarranted concessions might occur. Historically, I think that more harm has been done to the profession by frightened, disunited pilot groups than by rogue representatives. The latter situation is more infuriating, but the former is harder to fix. :( |
Originally Posted by acl65pilot
(Post 926651)
Oh they will ask and try to assign great value to it, [the 100 seater] but the fact is that we would have to play their game to accept that value. We already own that flying. If we sold it for a bargaining credit, we are the fools.
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