Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
03-17-2011, 03:55 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by sailingfun
Depending on what happens at NRT and the price of fuel there are some scary discussions going on about the 747 fleet plan. Rumor is all interior mods are on hold. Thats not good news.
03-17-2011, 03:57 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by themanager
where does one start.
The l1011 fleet
md-11's
767 dump trucks
727's
737 200's
737 300's
737 g's
what did i forget?
The l1011 fleet
md-11's
767 dump trucks
727's
737 200's
737 300's
737 g's
what did i forget?
747-200
03-17-2011, 04:01 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by johnso29
16 747's is a ton of capacity that you can't just replace quickly. Especially for an airline that refuses to buy new airplanes and has trouble getting used ones on line. Japan will bounce back. The company wants to be ready to jump on that market, and parking 747's would kill any chances of being able to do so IMO. I can't see them just parking them.
03-17-2011, 04:11 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by Dirty
Since DALPA and ACL don't see it as a threat... I'm glad DAL is willing to take a stance.
Maybe they'll use a SA or Chautauqua airplane to compete with F9. Wouldn't that make sense.
PREDATORY AIRLINE BEHAVIOR IS BACK
Delta Air Lines Needs To Abandon Anticompetitive Response To New Entry
U.S. DOJ / State AGs should be on the alert
March 16, 2011, RADNOR, PA – It’s deja vu all over again as Delta Air Lines seeks to maintain its monopoly position at Minneapolis St. Paul International Airport (MSP) by retaliating against Frontier Airlines for deciding to initiate scheduled service from Kansas City to MSP on June 6, 2011. In a response that can only be considered retaliatory and anticompetitive, Delta beginning on June 6 will start flights from Kansas City to Boston, Columbus and New Orleans, and from Omaha to Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport – all overlaying Frontier’s schedules. This is a page from Northwest Airlines’ playbook reminiscent of its 1993 response to entry by tiny Reno Air when Northwest announced it would overlay the carrier's routes from Reno to MSP, Seattle, Los Angeles and San Diego.
“As we saw in the U.S. during the 1990s, strategies of predation seek to drive low-cost competitors out of markets and create barriers - literal barriers of fear - for potential new entrants. Consumers may benefit from below-cost pricing in the short term, but once a new entrant is driven from a market, the incumbent airline can raise prices above competitive levels and recoup the “investment” in its strategy of predation,” said Business Travel Coalition chairman Kevin Mitchell.
“Just as importantly, the anticompetitive behavior sends an unmistakable message to other competitors to not trespass on the incumbent’s markets anywhere in its network, negatively impacting consumers even more broadly. Make no mistake, Delta's heavy-handed, punitive attack on this low-cost carrier is meant to chill all other low-cost airlines that might otherwise try to mount competition at one of the most concentrated hub airports in the U.S.,” added Mitchell.
In 2008 testimony before the U.S. Senate and House, in opposition to the proposed Northwest – Delta merger, BTC forewarned about the consequences of creating mega carriers and driving radical consolidation of the U.S. marketplace for commercial aviation services:
Strategies of Predation. “The resulting mega carriers would fortify their hubs with near-exclusive contracts with corporations and travel management companies, and other well-tested practices such as gate hoarding, schedule bracketing, triple frequent flyer points and travel agency override programs, making the barriers-to-entry for low-cost carriers of the 1990s seem low. Congress should be concerned with the market power of super-mega airlines and their incentive and means to frustrate new airline entry at hub airports.”
Indeed, the Delta-Northwest merger created the largest airline in the world; one that possesses the market dominance necessary to frustrate new entry at its hub airports, and one that can project its considerable power into adjacent markets, as also noted in BTC’s 2008 testimony:
Adjacent Market Power. “Congress should be concerned with these mega carriers’ ability to drive supplier prices to below competitive rates for travel agencies, travel management companies, airports, global distribution systems, parts suppliers, caterers and all manner of supply chain participants. Likewise, these carriers would have the power to accelerate the transfer of costs onto the backs of consumers.”
Delta’s move against Frontier adds further evidence and warning that the U.S. commercial aviation market is failing. Indeed, some two and one half years into the widespread implementation of programs that unbundle airline services from the base ticket, market forces are inadequate to drive airlines to make fee information available to the travel agency sales channel. As a consequence, not only were many consumers surprised at the airport by some $9.2 billion in airline fees in 2010, but because those fees are withheld from travel agencies and cloaked from the pricing discipline of a comparative shopping process, they are artificially high. This resulting economic inefficiency is a strong indication of market failure and cause for concern.
The U.S. Department of Justice and State Attorneys General should be on high alert to the return of strategies of predation and other anti-competitive practices in the airline industry. As serious as predation was in the 1990s as a threat to consumers and the competitive structure of the airline industry, today consolidation has made potential consequences worse by orders of magnitude. The U.S. DOJ and State AGs should send an equally unmistakable message back to Delta that it is being watched and that abusive, anticompetitive behavior in the airline industry will not be tolerated. Business travelers and consumers have been pummeled by a series of airfare increases, many of them hidden, over the last few years. They need -- and deserve -- more airline competition and not the return of old tricks of the past that are designed to kill it.
Maybe they'll use a SA or Chautauqua airplane to compete with F9. Wouldn't that make sense.
PREDATORY AIRLINE BEHAVIOR IS BACK
Delta Air Lines Needs To Abandon Anticompetitive Response To New Entry
U.S. DOJ / State AGs should be on the alert
March 16, 2011, RADNOR, PA – It’s deja vu all over again as Delta Air Lines seeks to maintain its monopoly position at Minneapolis St. Paul International Airport (MSP) by retaliating against Frontier Airlines for deciding to initiate scheduled service from Kansas City to MSP on June 6, 2011. In a response that can only be considered retaliatory and anticompetitive, Delta beginning on June 6 will start flights from Kansas City to Boston, Columbus and New Orleans, and from Omaha to Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport – all overlaying Frontier’s schedules. This is a page from Northwest Airlines’ playbook reminiscent of its 1993 response to entry by tiny Reno Air when Northwest announced it would overlay the carrier's routes from Reno to MSP, Seattle, Los Angeles and San Diego.
“As we saw in the U.S. during the 1990s, strategies of predation seek to drive low-cost competitors out of markets and create barriers - literal barriers of fear - for potential new entrants. Consumers may benefit from below-cost pricing in the short term, but once a new entrant is driven from a market, the incumbent airline can raise prices above competitive levels and recoup the “investment” in its strategy of predation,” said Business Travel Coalition chairman Kevin Mitchell.
“Just as importantly, the anticompetitive behavior sends an unmistakable message to other competitors to not trespass on the incumbent’s markets anywhere in its network, negatively impacting consumers even more broadly. Make no mistake, Delta's heavy-handed, punitive attack on this low-cost carrier is meant to chill all other low-cost airlines that might otherwise try to mount competition at one of the most concentrated hub airports in the U.S.,” added Mitchell.
In 2008 testimony before the U.S. Senate and House, in opposition to the proposed Northwest – Delta merger, BTC forewarned about the consequences of creating mega carriers and driving radical consolidation of the U.S. marketplace for commercial aviation services:
Strategies of Predation. “The resulting mega carriers would fortify their hubs with near-exclusive contracts with corporations and travel management companies, and other well-tested practices such as gate hoarding, schedule bracketing, triple frequent flyer points and travel agency override programs, making the barriers-to-entry for low-cost carriers of the 1990s seem low. Congress should be concerned with the market power of super-mega airlines and their incentive and means to frustrate new airline entry at hub airports.”
Indeed, the Delta-Northwest merger created the largest airline in the world; one that possesses the market dominance necessary to frustrate new entry at its hub airports, and one that can project its considerable power into adjacent markets, as also noted in BTC’s 2008 testimony:
Adjacent Market Power. “Congress should be concerned with these mega carriers’ ability to drive supplier prices to below competitive rates for travel agencies, travel management companies, airports, global distribution systems, parts suppliers, caterers and all manner of supply chain participants. Likewise, these carriers would have the power to accelerate the transfer of costs onto the backs of consumers.”
Delta’s move against Frontier adds further evidence and warning that the U.S. commercial aviation market is failing. Indeed, some two and one half years into the widespread implementation of programs that unbundle airline services from the base ticket, market forces are inadequate to drive airlines to make fee information available to the travel agency sales channel. As a consequence, not only were many consumers surprised at the airport by some $9.2 billion in airline fees in 2010, but because those fees are withheld from travel agencies and cloaked from the pricing discipline of a comparative shopping process, they are artificially high. This resulting economic inefficiency is a strong indication of market failure and cause for concern.
The U.S. Department of Justice and State Attorneys General should be on high alert to the return of strategies of predation and other anti-competitive practices in the airline industry. As serious as predation was in the 1990s as a threat to consumers and the competitive structure of the airline industry, today consolidation has made potential consequences worse by orders of magnitude. The U.S. DOJ and State AGs should send an equally unmistakable message back to Delta that it is being watched and that abusive, anticompetitive behavior in the airline industry will not be tolerated. Business travelers and consumers have been pummeled by a series of airfare increases, many of them hidden, over the last few years. They need -- and deserve -- more airline competition and not the return of old tricks of the past that are designed to kill it.
What I have been hashing, once again on here, is that yes, we may not like what DAL is doing with F9 with adding flying to their certificate, there is nothing illegal about it. Changing the structure of their corporation will cause DALPA to press to test on this issue, and I would like to see nothing more. That said, unless something changes, sadly, it is nothing new, and something that has been going on for quite some time.
All of the anger is great, but all it is doing is creating heat. What it needs to be doing is creating movement and leverage for our union to get the wording changed in the PWA.
Also remember that DAL made this bed, and it is good from our perspective to see them twist in the wind from it. They will learn from it. In the end that helps us to do what needs to be done, not what should have been done. Look forward, and change what we can today and tomorrow.
03-17-2011, 04:19 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Roadkill;
To answer the question:
You have a PD (Personal Drop) and a APD (Authorized Personal Drop) every year.
For normal ops, you can put a trip on the swap board, and anyone can pick it up. You can state if you are offering it as a Pick Up only or a Swap only, or both. You can drop down to zero hrs this way, and yes, I have seen it happen a few times. This is the best way to drop trips.
Depending on where you are commuting from SLC can be great or horrible.
As for the L and G thread, the union back and forth has only started as a result of people like me who think that an independent union is the wrong idea, and frankly am willing to fight for what we have. Sorry if you do not want to read it.
To answer the question:
You have a PD (Personal Drop) and a APD (Authorized Personal Drop) every year.
For normal ops, you can put a trip on the swap board, and anyone can pick it up. You can state if you are offering it as a Pick Up only or a Swap only, or both. You can drop down to zero hrs this way, and yes, I have seen it happen a few times. This is the best way to drop trips.
Depending on where you are commuting from SLC can be great or horrible.
As for the L and G thread, the union back and forth has only started as a result of people like me who think that an independent union is the wrong idea, and frankly am willing to fight for what we have. Sorry if you do not want to read it.
03-17-2011, 04:21 AM
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
Originally Posted by TANSTAAFL
I'm sure lots of austerity measures are probably being formulated. Heard from a friend who spoke to crew resources that 330 to ATL is on hold as well.
Better hope they don't park the 744 - that's roughly 300 very senior captains and 300 very senior F/O's to waterfall through other aircraft. Lots of pay cuts, stunted career growth, and maybe the word we whose name we do not speak.
Better hope they don't park the 744 - that's roughly 300 very senior captains and 300 very senior F/O's to waterfall through other aircraft. Lots of pay cuts, stunted career growth, and maybe the word we whose name we do not speak.
03-17-2011, 04:52 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,360
Originally Posted by acl65pilot
As I have said DAL is saving cash where they can, but this is rumor. The one thing that appears not to be effected is cabin mods. If anything the Mod lines will go up in an effort to get the fleet done sooner.
If the cabin mods are done on schedule or accelerated then they are keeping the aircraft. If they are canceled then its bad news. Very bad news.
03-17-2011, 05:01 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,619
Originally Posted by Roadkill
Question for the folks who live here: I stumbled into this forum and thread when googling for what a white slip was, and most google searches seem to lead here... But I do see a lot of you guys posting in other threads I've just started looking at.
Is there another good forum or place where guys post about flying for Delta, schedules, rumors, etc., but without the 95% union/anti-union posts? No offense, I'm just looking for a place to learn and enjoy, but all this constant bickering is a real downer... I'd end up hanging myself in a month if I kept reading all of it, or a month ago if it weren't for FTB's artistic skills. Any recommendations for a Delta pilots place slightly toned down?
Is there another good forum or place where guys post about flying for Delta, schedules, rumors, etc., but without the 95% union/anti-union posts? No offense, I'm just looking for a place to learn and enjoy, but all this constant bickering is a real downer... I'd end up hanging myself in a month if I kept reading all of it, or a month ago if it weren't for FTB's artistic skills. Any recommendations for a Delta pilots place slightly toned down?
03-17-2011, 05:02 AM
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
deleted....
03-17-2011, 05:05 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,716
Originally Posted by sailingfun
Depending on what happens at NRT and the price of fuel there are some scary discussions going on about the 747 fleet plan. Rumor is all interior mods are on hold. Thats not good news.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
