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Old 12-22-2011 | 07:59 PM
  #84191  
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Originally Posted by 80ktsClamp
It sure would be nice if DALPA called the company's obvious and half hearted bluff to justify the RJocalypse in LGA.... but that might be asking too much.

I really thought at the beginning of that C44 letter that they might actually be starting to play some hardball. I don't know why I'm surprised each time I'm so very disappointed in them...
December 20, 2011

Fellow Council 66 members,

Friday's LGA schedule announcement for spring 2012 has caused many of our members to express both anger and disappointment. If you are one of those individuals, read on.

Brief history: The slot swap deal was originally proposed almost two years ago, but met with stiff regulatory resistance. Modified terms and the United-Continental and Southwest-AirTran mergers changed the landscape such that regulators eventually approved a modified deal. On December 16, Delta announced its new schedule for the first phase of an eventual LaGuardia hub.

Of more than 100 new flights and 29 new destinations, only 7.5 percent were designated as mainline.

A number of our pilots are just plain angry at reading about so many RJ, and so few mainline flights. Pilots are upset over their lack of career progression. Many perceive the two to be directly related. Because the company never stated publicly, in advance of the transaction, how many slots would be flown by mainline — the ratio of mainline to regional flying has come as a shock to many of our pilots.After all, if Delta was awarded the slots, why does it appear that other companies are benefitting from the transaction?Many of us had the expectation that a greater proportion of mainline flying would be announced. Naturally, there is disappointment. We are disappointed as well.

We can’t justify or explain management’s marketing/networking rationale. That responsibility rests squarely on the shoulders of Delta management, and the MEC administration has communicated to management that they should more clearly communicate the long-term plan for the LGA hub. With that said, the reality is that this expansion is far from an end-state. We will not know what the end-state will look like for some time, possibly 2-3 years by some estimates.

We won’t attempt to justify the schedule for LGA, because we don’t make those decisions, but we do believe that ultimately it is in the best interests of the Delta pilots for Delta to dominate the NYC market. So here goes our take on the facts, as best we know them. As your elected representatives, we are happy to discuss this and any other issues with you, at any time. But we will not make false predictions, nor will we speculate.
  • Delta is building a domestic hub in LGA.
  • Delta will initially be flying into a number of destinations previously served by US Airways connection carriers. In many cases these markets were served with turboprops. US Airways Express feed is being replaced with (often larger) DCI feed.
  • LGA is slot restricted; Long-term capacity growth can only come from up-gauging.
  • Scope protection is alive and well. Scope provisions are capping out on 70+ seat jets, with the ability to only acquire two more aircraft to reach the limit of 255 70+ seat jets allowed. We are already capped out on 76-seat jets.
  • 50-seaters' continue to be parked (RJ footprint continues to shrink)
  • The only aircraft Delta is buying are domestic narrow bodies, specifically MD-90s and the recently announced 737-900s. These aircraft will enter service over the next few years.
  • While the 737-900s will replace aircraft that are planned for retirement, Delta has the flexibility to expand as well depending on economic conditions and marketing opportunities.
  • DCI aircraft that are coming to NY are not newly acquired.No new RJs have been acquired to fund this expansion.
  • This is a real estate deal, and a slot deal. It does not come with passengers. It's a business deal that will take time to unfold. This starts with what Delta determines to be the right size feed. The phase in will be over time and could change as markets bear fruit, or as they fail to do so.
  • Delta is essentially a “new entrant” into many of these markets either in totality or in terms of frequency, and it will take time to build market share.
  • All RJ flying in the newly announced schedule is a reallocation of existing flying, from other markets.
  • The company designs its business plan. Many factors are involved. NY is one piece of the puzzle.
  • An important component of the slot swap deal involves significant construction at LGA. That construction will require roughly one year, maybe longer. Once complete, Delta will be able to execute a full schedule out of a fully functional new facility. Delta can’t do that from the onset.
  • Delta will have a competitive advantage in NYC as a result of the slot swap.
  • With respect to the new A320 category in NYC, there is no direct correlation to the approval of the slot swap. The new category was primarily intended to reduce system credit time.
  • LGA will increase from 41 to 56 flight/day on the A320; a small reduction will take place at JFK. The NYC320 category is being ramped up rapidly.
  • We want the company to be wildly profitable.
  • Yes, we want to see more mainline aircraft in NYC.
    We desire career progression. We desire a better contract.
  • We’re just a few months away from exchanging contract openers. Our PWA amendable date is December 31, 2012. Think: Job Security, pay, benefits and working conditions.
Ultimately, we believe that the slot swap, terminal expansion and LGA hub operation will benefit the Delta pilots. As for the initial spring 2012 schedule, we reiterate that this is a management decision.

As always, we remain open to your thoughts and ideas, and we welcome your comments.

Fly safe.



Chairman
Council 66 Capt. Rep

Vice Chairman
Council 66 F/O Rep

Secretary-Treasurer
Old 12-22-2011 | 08:09 PM
  #84192  
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Joined: Feb 2007
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From: 765-A
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Originally Posted by BigGuns
December 20, 2011

Fellow Council 66 members,

Friday's LGA schedule announcement for spring 2012 has caused many of our members to express both anger and disappointment. If you are one of those individuals, read on.....


  • Delta is building a domestic hub in LGA.
  • Delta will initially be flying into a number of destinations previously served by US Airways connection carriers. In many cases these markets were served with turboprops. US Airways Express feed is being replaced with (often larger) DCI feed.
  • Scope protection is alive and well. Scope provisions are capping out on 70+ seat jets, with the ability to only acquire two more aircraft to reach the limit of 255 70+ seat jets allowed. We are already capped out on 76-seat jets.
  • WE WANT TO FLY 70+ SEAT AIRCRAFT AND WILL APPROACH THE COMPANY WITH THAT REQUEST.
  • We want the company to be wildly profitable.
  • Yes, we want to see more mainline aircraft in NYC.
    We desire career progression. We desire a better contract.
  • We’re just a few months away from exchanging contract openers. Our PWA amendable date is December 31, 2012. Think: Job Security, pay, benefits and working conditions. AND A RECAPTURE OF LOST SCOPE.
As always, we remain open to your thoughts and ideas, and we welcome your comments.

Fly safe.



Chairman
Council 66 Capt. Rep

Vice Chairman
Council 66 F/O Rep

Secretary-Treasurer
Maybe their pens with red ink ran out. I filled it in for them.
Old 12-22-2011 | 08:17 PM
  #84193  
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Joined: Dec 2009
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From: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
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Originally Posted by forgot to bid
No way. You act like the ERJ-145 at DCI...



is not as good as a Jetblue E190 staffed by Jetblue employees...



You're just wrong. Because watch, for as long as we compete with them on this route, it'll be on that E145 operated by an airline we probably signed a long term expensive contract with a guaranteed profit or something.

See! So it's obvious, the E145 flown by some DCI is better than that Jetblue thing and so people are going to flock to us.

Of course if we get 717s... nah, Delta will never ever get 717s.

Hey, who's that F/A standing up there? He's hot!

You know what walking a tight rope, and getting a BJ from one of our Senior Mommas has in common?

It's not too scary, as long as you don't look down...
Old 12-22-2011 | 08:20 PM
  #84194  
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veut gagner à la loterie
 
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Posts: 23,286
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From: Light Chop
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Originally Posted by newKnow
I had to edit the letter to include what I wish more people would say.....
Can you hear the crickets chirping?

Which brings up a question. Back when I was in middle school Naughty by Nature came out with "You down with OPP?"

Now we all know what OPP meant. Our teacher tried to tell us that he "knew what it meant" and therefore was cool- but most of us really didn't know what it meant.

That's beside the point.

it's time to ask DALPA, you down with OPP? As in other people's planes? Cuz I ain't down with it.

That or OPP.

Old Peoples Pectorals

[IMAGE]ERASED[IMAGE]

Image was an old man wearing a wal-mart plastic trash bag, the ones not big enough to hold a box of pizza, with legs cut out and his arms in the handles, must not be mentally balanced. So I will erase the picture. Consider yourself lucky.
Old 12-22-2011 | 08:25 PM
  #84195  
forgot to bid's Avatar
veut gagner à la loterie
 
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 23,286
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From: Light Chop
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Originally Posted by Timbo
Hey, who's that F/A standing up there? He's hot!

You know what walking a tight rope, and getting a BJ from one of our Senior Mommas has in common?

It's not too scary, as long as you don't look down...
Timbo. Take that imagery back.
Old 12-22-2011 | 08:27 PM
  #84196  
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veut gagner à la loterie
 
Joined: Apr 2008
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From: Light Chop
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Originally Posted by newKnow
That's right, I ain't goin' 'cause I can't. Seems as though green slips only come up with I am on vacation!

....Plus, if I've got a "spread" like that, it's best for me to say home.
That's an awfully tiny tog you're holding there newk.

See that must have been pre marriage days. You holding the dog and she sitting like that, those things don't happen after marriage and they sure as hell don't happen after kids.
Old 12-22-2011 | 08:28 PM
  #84197  
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veut gagner à la loterie
 
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From: Light Chop
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Speaking of kids, it's 1228am, they'll be up in an hour.

See ya!
Old 12-22-2011 | 08:34 PM
  #84198  
Dirty's Avatar
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 102
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From: A330B
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Originally Posted by BigGuns
December 20, 2011

Fellow Council 66 members,

Friday's LGA schedule announcement for spring 2012 has caused many of our members to express both anger and disappointment. If you are one of those individuals, read on.

Brief history: The slot swap deal was originally proposed almost two years ago, but met with stiff regulatory resistance. Modified terms and the United-Continental and Southwest-AirTran mergers changed the landscape such that regulators eventually approved a modified deal. On December 16, Delta announced its new schedule for the first phase of an eventual LaGuardia hub.

Of more than 100 new flights and 29 new destinations, only 7.5 percent were designated as mainline.

A number of our pilots are just plain angry at reading about so many RJ, and so few mainline flights. Pilots are upset over their lack of career progression. Many perceive the two to be directly related. Because the company never stated publicly, in advance of the transaction, how many slots would be flown by mainline — the ratio of mainline to regional flying has come as a shock to many of our pilots.After all, if Delta was awarded the slots, why does it appear that other companies are benefitting from the transaction?Many of us had the expectation that a greater proportion of mainline flying would be announced. Naturally, there is disappointment. We are disappointed as well.

We can’t justify or explain management’s marketing/networking rationale. That responsibility rests squarely on the shoulders of Delta management, and the MEC administration has communicated to management that they should more clearly communicate the long-term plan for the LGA hub. With that said, the reality is that this expansion is far from an end-state. We will not know what the end-state will look like for some time, possibly 2-3 years by some estimates.

We won’t attempt to justify the schedule for LGA, because we don’t make those decisions, but we do believe that ultimately it is in the best interests of the Delta pilots for Delta to dominate the NYC market. So here goes our take on the facts, as best we know them. As your elected representatives, we are happy to discuss this and any other issues with you, at any time. But we will not make false predictions, nor will we speculate.
  • Delta is building a domestic hub in LGA.
  • Delta will initially be flying into a number of destinations previously served by US Airways connection carriers. In many cases these markets were served with turboprops. US Airways Express feed is being replaced with (often larger) DCI feed.
  • LGA is slot restricted; Long-term capacity growth can only come from up-gauging.
  • Scope protection is alive and well. Scope provisions are capping out on 70+ seat jets, with the ability to only acquire two more aircraft to reach the limit of 255 70+ seat jets allowed. We are already capped out on 76-seat jets.
  • 50-seaters' continue to be parked (RJ footprint continues to shrink)
  • The only aircraft Delta is buying are domestic narrow bodies, specifically MD-90s and the recently announced 737-900s. These aircraft will enter service over the next few years.
  • While the 737-900s will replace aircraft that are planned for retirement, Delta has the flexibility to expand as well depending on economic conditions and marketing opportunities.
  • DCI aircraft that are coming to NY are not newly acquired.No new RJs have been acquired to fund this expansion.
  • This is a real estate deal, and a slot deal. It does not come with passengers. It's a business deal that will take time to unfold. This starts with what Delta determines to be the right size feed. The phase in will be over time and could change as markets bear fruit, or as they fail to do so.
  • Delta is essentially a “new entrant” into many of these markets either in totality or in terms of frequency, and it will take time to build market share.
  • All RJ flying in the newly announced schedule is a reallocation of existing flying, from other markets.
  • The company designs its business plan. Many factors are involved. NY is one piece of the puzzle.
  • An important component of the slot swap deal involves significant construction at LGA. That construction will require roughly one year, maybe longer. Once complete, Delta will be able to execute a full schedule out of a fully functional new facility. Delta can’t do that from the onset.
  • Delta will have a competitive advantage in NYC as a result of the slot swap.
  • With respect to the new A320 category in NYC, there is no direct correlation to the approval of the slot swap. The new category was primarily intended to reduce system credit time.
  • LGA will increase from 41 to 56 flight/day on the A320; a small reduction will take place at JFK. The NYC320 category is being ramped up rapidly.
  • We want the company to be wildly profitable.
  • Yes, we want to see more mainline aircraft in NYC.
    We desire career progression. We desire a better contract.
  • We’re just a few months away from exchanging contract openers. Our PWA amendable date is December 31, 2012. Think: Job Security, pay, benefits and working conditions.
Ultimately, we believe that the slot swap, terminal expansion and LGA hub operation will benefit the Delta pilots. As for the initial spring 2012 schedule, we reiterate that this is a management decision.

As always, we remain open to your thoughts and ideas, and we welcome your comments.

Fly safe.



Chairman
Council 66 Capt. Rep

Vice Chairman
Council 66 F/O Rep

Secretary-Treasurer

But they always touted how they would improve the NYC airspace by adding capacity and reducing arrivals/departures. Although they never gave a ratio they definately implied that mainline would be doing the majority of the flying. This was further perpetrated by rumors coming from the LCA meetings that 70%ish would be mainline.

Let's face it boys we were dupped.
Old 12-22-2011 | 08:37 PM
  #84199  
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From: 765-A
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Originally Posted by forgot to bid
That's an awfully tiny tog you're holding there newk.

See that must have been pre marriage days. You holding the dog and she sitting like that, those things don't happen after marriage and they sure as hell don't happen after kids.
That can't be my wife. Look at al that expensive jewelry she's wearing. I'm a 21st century airline pilot. I can barely afford the dog.

If I were a 20th century airline pilot, I could claim the wife, jewelry, house, and I would have gotten a bigger, meaner looking dog.

Ok. Time to hit the books. C-ya!
Old 12-22-2011 | 09:02 PM
  #84200  
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 4,207
Likes: 53
From: Legacy FO
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While flying a transcon tonight, I overheard a lot of pilots talking on guard about CNBC saying that AMR, jetBlue, and USAir were tying the knot. Any truth to that?
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