Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta?
02-16-2012, 11:46 PM
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
Originally Posted by Jesse
What, too big a softball for everyone?
02-17-2012, 01:50 AM
Weekend and Holiday Pilot
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: Sippin' at the Troubadour
Posts: 1,141
Originally Posted by tsquare
All I can say is that we exchange openers in about a month and a half. The donuts are causing disunity which we cannot afford. THEY are going to do the damage.
02-17-2012, 03:00 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2010
Posts: 109
Originally Posted by KC10 FATboy
As the only DAL guy in my reserve unit, I also have seen and heard the same thing. Mil pilots want nothing to do with DAL anymore. Mil pilots who get hired only by DAL, do so in hopes of switching to FDX, UPS, and SWA. I know this personally as I have tried to do the same. I know two bubbas who left DAL for SWA, and a couple for FDX. I've never heard of anyone leaving FDX, UPS, or SWA to come to DAL.
Mil pilots on active duty (those who can get out) are making $100-120K per year. The desert meat grinder is slowly coming to an end. QOL is improving on the mil side. Right now, there is NO financial incentive for anyone to want to leave the military and come to DAL. It has taken me 5 years to make the same pay that I did on active duty. However, for me, I will take DAL QOL any day over the chair force's.
Mil pilots on active duty (those who can get out) are making $100-120K per year. The desert meat grinder is slowly coming to an end. QOL is improving on the mil side. Right now, there is NO financial incentive for anyone to want to leave the military and come to DAL. It has taken me 5 years to make the same pay that I did on active duty. However, for me, I will take DAL QOL any day over the chair force's.
Take home pay for a 12yr 7ER is over $50K less/year than a 20 year Lt Col living in the DC area. 11.2K/mo vs approx 6K/mo. 7ER mileage may vary, but again this is TAKE HOME pay.
So after 12+ years and a $50K annual retirement, you may equal your active duty earnings....
This is why they are looking elsewhere.
02-17-2012, 04:23 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,990
Originally Posted by Boomer
Excerpted from the CVR transcript of Comair 5191. KLEX, Aug 27, 2006
02-17-2012, 04:38 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 710
Originally Posted by Boomer
No, Delta has 800,000,000 Regional Jets floating around.
It has around 850 million shares as well.
It has around 850 million shares as well.
02-17-2012, 04:39 AM
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 11,990
Alpha,
What can I say? Congratulations for unifying a group as different as Carl, ACL65, and me ... that's an accomplishment.
What this should indicate is that when the Company is on track for a 2 Billion dollar profit, displacements and staffing cuts, early outs and outsourcing, are not acceptable to your pilot group. ALPA needs to figure this out and get on the right side of the issue. That's scope; from Joint Venture & Codeshare, to the 2 year GoJets Captain flying out of LGA. ALPA needs to get on board with its pilots.
Cycle, with the displacements a lot of pilots will dip in 2012 to less than their Regional pay; I'd guess about 1,100 or so (+ or - those who were hired as FO's). When you correct for inflation the number is larger.
Again, the point is that outsourcing is an abrogation of seniority. Those GoJets pilots doing our flying out of LGA are also earning a lot less than we did as Regional pilots. The Comair pilots who are furloughed are making nothing. The common interest we all have is that a lack of good scope policy is allowing this career destruction.
My reasoning for applying to Delta (aside from the fact I always wanted to fly Delta) was to align the name of the side of the airplane to my paycheck; and have my MEC negotiate my scope. As much as I carp about it, they've protected us better than we would have been protected at any of the regionals.
In other words, we came to the best island in a group of islands which are slipping beneath the waves as a result of inadequate protections.
What can I say? Congratulations for unifying a group as different as Carl, ACL65, and me ... that's an accomplishment.
What this should indicate is that when the Company is on track for a 2 Billion dollar profit, displacements and staffing cuts, early outs and outsourcing, are not acceptable to your pilot group. ALPA needs to figure this out and get on the right side of the issue. That's scope; from Joint Venture & Codeshare, to the 2 year GoJets Captain flying out of LGA. ALPA needs to get on board with its pilots.
Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
When someone is describing a company as "slowly liquidating", they're talking about the assets, such as aircraft. If memory serves, DAL is operating ~70 aircraft less now than right after the merger.
The fact that we still have roughly the same number of pilots as when we had 70 more aircraft only proves that we're way fat on pilots right now, which all of us already know. It does nothing to bolster your goofy attempt at trying to "prove" we're not slowly liquidating. It's all the more troubling that you behave this way as one of our unelected MEC bureaucrats. Everytime you guys try this type of obfuscation, you lose more credibility.
Carl
The fact that we still have roughly the same number of pilots as when we had 70 more aircraft only proves that we're way fat on pilots right now, which all of us already know. It does nothing to bolster your goofy attempt at trying to "prove" we're not slowly liquidating. It's all the more troubling that you behave this way as one of our unelected MEC bureaucrats. Everytime you guys try this type of obfuscation, you lose more credibility.
Carl
Originally Posted by acl65pilot
Carl
DAL needs to be replacing 35 airplanes a year to renew the fleet every 20 years. We are far from that and that is concerning. A lot of our jets are getting older and many will need to replace about the same time. That is a lot of money at once.
DAL needs to be replacing 35 airplanes a year to renew the fleet every 20 years. We are far from that and that is concerning. A lot of our jets are getting older and many will need to replace about the same time. That is a lot of money at once.
Originally Posted by Cycle Pilot
Took me almost 4 years to make was I was making at a regional! That's just sad!
Again, the point is that outsourcing is an abrogation of seniority. Those GoJets pilots doing our flying out of LGA are also earning a lot less than we did as Regional pilots. The Comair pilots who are furloughed are making nothing. The common interest we all have is that a lack of good scope policy is allowing this career destruction.
My reasoning for applying to Delta (aside from the fact I always wanted to fly Delta) was to align the name of the side of the airplane to my paycheck; and have my MEC negotiate my scope. As much as I carp about it, they've protected us better than we would have been protected at any of the regionals.
In other words, we came to the best island in a group of islands which are slipping beneath the waves as a result of inadequate protections.
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 02-17-2012 at 05:19 AM.
02-17-2012, 04:42 AM
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Joined APC: Apr 2009
Posts: 917
Originally Posted by bucking bar
i've long thought a contributory factor for that accident was the announcement the previous thursday that the company's flying was being put out to bid, with massive displacements and loss of income coming.
02-17-2012, 04:51 AM
On Reserve
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Position: M88 starboard
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
That has nothing to do with the fact that we are operating about 70 less aircraft than we did after the merger. Then there's the closing of buildings and facilities, and "layoffs" of non frontline employees. By any measure, that is a slow liquidation. The only argument I might have with Bar is him calling it slow.
Carl
Carl
02-17-2012, 04:54 AM
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Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: B737 CA
Posts: 1,518
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
I've long thought a contributory factor for that accident was the announcement the previous Thursday that the Company's flying was being put out to bid, with massive displacements and loss of income coming.
A pilot worried sick about money, job security, and other personal issues is not a safe pilot. With the DCI shuffle game that Delta plays, there have been an awful lot of pilots with reasons to be distracted flying paying Delta passengers around.
If DALPA ever gets its head out of its arse and goes after recapturing small jet scope, this should be a primary justification to the public: it's about safety. It's also a good reason to restore mainline wages, really. It's ridiculous that we have 5-year mainline pilots on their first marriage and with young families worried about money.
02-17-2012, 05:07 AM
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Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: FO
Posts: 3,032
Originally Posted by Bucking Bar
I've long thought a contributory factor for that accident was the announcement the previous Thursday that the Company's flying was being put out to bid, with massive displacements and loss of income coming.
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