Any "Latest & Greatest" about Delta? - Page 9822

#98211

Rather B Fishin , 05-07-2012 06:42 PM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl Spackler

You should if you're going to brag NOW about how ALPA will be delaying this for 10+ years because of their deep pockets. The exact same smarmy behavior seen from corrupt management teams who look to shirk their responsibilities instead of manning up for their own actions. Rooting for this type of behavior as johnso29 has done is creepy. It's not what trade unionists should be bragging about. Carl

Well the goods news is that if DPA becomes our union/association we won't have to worry about it. We will just be unionists, not trade unionists.

#98212

nwaf16dude , 05-07-2012 07:00 PM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by hockeypilot44

I'm glad I'm not the only one that sees this as a piece of crap. I just hope the pilots on the line feel the same as on this board. I am truly in disbelief about how bad things have gone. Things I never in a million years thought we would give up are under consideration.

I was on a hotel bus today and overheard a conversation between a regional guy and a fairly senior looking wide body FO. This FO did not know if we were hiring or furloughing, and also didn't know when our contract was amendable. Pretty sure this guy is either an easy yes vote on anything, or not even going to vote. It's hard for me to imagine how one could be so unaware. I hope there aren't many like that, but I fear otherwise.

#98213

acl65pilot , 05-07-2012 07:05 PM

Happy to be here

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwaf16dude

They are out there and they have been sitting in the right seat of a WB for some time....

#98214

Carl Spackler , 05-07-2012 07:11 PM

Back on TDY

Quote:

Originally Posted by LivingTheDream

Your kidding right? As I told my rep, if Delta wants to be inefficient, that is their choice...but they still need to pay me to be away from my family...being away from my family for my employer = (wait for it) work. I.e. If I go one minute past midnight, it's another day of pay. Very tired of the deadhead only day, 24hr layovers, red-eyes, etc., not paying for my time away from my family. YMMV. I will vote accordingly.

You're right man. I've given this another look and my previous thought that maybe this could be accepted by getting SWAPA's scope - still wouldn't be enough. I originally saw this ALV stuff as an example of neutral bargaining where you give away something to get something. But this is a straight-up concession. This would be neutral bargaining if the increases in ALV were offset by a 6.5 to 7 hour per day minimum daily credit...but that's NOT the case. Thus the folks here calling this a flat out concession are right.

Absolute NO vote from me and yet another urging of my reps to vote this down. I cannot imagine how our MEC bureaucrats could be this out of touch with us.

Carl

#98215

Columbia , 05-07-2012 07:11 PM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by nwaf16dude

Yep-that seems to be the type the mec is hoping for.

#98216

Carl Spackler , 05-07-2012 07:13 PM

Back on TDY

Quote:

Originally Posted by gloopy

Not to mention giving up staffing relief, especially in the summer, as well as contemplating any more DC-9 replacement jets at DCI.

Thinking we're going to get offsets to all the negatives in the NNP is Nevil Chamberlain-esque in its optimism. I see nothing to indicate that trajectory and lots to the contrary. Yet what we get, as bad as it may be, will be agressively sold as an all around win or at the very least "the best we could get". Every CBA in history always is. But I think what's coming our way real soon is going to suck for the sake of expediency and be spun as a good deal.

Significant staffing relief? More DC-9 replacement jets at DCI? Hopefully the reps will nip that in the bud but I suspect they will be strongly pressured to send it to us. Either way, if its the POS many deduct that its going to be,

From your lips to every line pilot's ears...

Carl

#98217

hockeypilot44 , 05-07-2012 07:17 PM

Gets Weekends Off

Quote:

Originally Posted by Carl Spackler

I can. We keep trying to give ALPA one more chance. They keep failing. They always get one more chance. This negotiating appears to be no different. We will give them another chance. We always do.

#98218

Carl Spackler , 05-07-2012 07:21 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Jack Bauer

Well said! I am surprised there isn't a bigger uproar over potentially flying pilots more hours. I know there are some that like flying more than being at home. I am not one of those people. Being away from home, family, events and sleeping in hotels for even 10 days a month (the more the worse) really jacks with trying to live a normal life.

Adding more potential forced flying is a no vote for me. The flip side of that, if there is language guaranteeing that I can bid for example a 50 hour schedule or take more days off on reserve when I need to then I might be ok with language allowing those who love to fly a million hours a year do their thing as well.

Money is important but what I want to see is more money while still living a half way normal life with my family and maintaining some semblance of health, circadian rhythm, family life etc.

The negotiating committee is headed the wrong way in my opinion.

Actually Jack, it's the MEC bureaucrats that are headed in the wrong direction. They run the union. The negotiating committee just runs the strategy set forth by the MEC bureaucrats. Our biggest problem is that our reps are routinely ignored and "mushroomed" by the MEC bureaucrats when our reps' opinions don't align with theirs.

Our reps are going to have a damn tough time with this. They'll be faced with knowing the MEC bureaucrats went off on their own again, and wondering whether punishing them for it is worth keeping pay increases away from the pilots they represent until the wrongs have been righted. This will be a much easier vote for our reps if they know we have THEIR backs if they vote this down and tell the MEC bureaucrats to pay F'N attention this time!

Carl

#98219

Carl Spackler , 05-07-2012 07:23 PM

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Timbo

I'm still not too clear on why the company came to us, to open early, and get this thing done quickly. All I've heard from my Rep. when I called him to ask is,

"Richard wants to pursue Other Opportunities..."

Ummm...Ok, but what's in it, for US?

Are we going to get MORE MONEY/Benefits/Retirement/Work rules, etc. (another 'bite of the apple') if/when this Other Opportunity comes about? What if we are still in contract negotiations a year from now, and Delta has just posted a $2Billion proffit?

What if Richard's "Other Opportunity" is...Getting the Pilots to rush into being locked into a substandard contract for several more years, with minimum pay/benefit restoration now, before Delta starts making $2Billion/yr. with his new cheap fuel farm?? Or before O'Bama gets re-elected, or before he buys...? someone else, shrinks the mainline (again) and gives our DC9 flying to yet another RJ operator? Or all of the above?

Unless we get a huge pay restoration, with huge retirement paybacks, with upside profit sharing protections for if/when his fuel farm (the one our pay cuts paid for) purchase starts 'paying off', and better scope/job protections, I'm in no hurry to commit to yet another long term bankruptcy pay rate/benefit contract (adjusted for inflation, we are still there today!).

I see no reason to rush into this, just because he -said- he's got "Other Opportunities".

As I tell my wife when ever she wants me to do housework;

"Don't Rush ME! If I rush, I'll make mistakes, and we don't want that now do we?"

Great post Timbo! Agree 100%.

Carl

#98220

Carl Spackler , 05-07-2012 07:28 PM

Back on TDY

Quote:

Originally Posted by Check Essential

Hopefully they are in the process of stopping this train wreck right now.
These negotiations have clearly gone terribly wrong.
Whatever "opportunity" has caused us to expedite the talks is not worth it.

The O'Malley administration and the negotiators have got to explain what has happened.
After all we've given through bankruptcy and everything, how in hell can we be negotiating more concessions?

The reps need to shut this thing down while there is still time.

I think they could effectively do that right now if they know we line pilots had their backs. Our reps should all know they have nothing to fear by recalling the MEC chairman and the entire MEC bureaucracy except the negotiating committee. The reps have to show everyone who is the boss here, or they will be showing everyone they're not.

Carl