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Originally Posted by tsquare
(Post 1187730)
We won't shrink by 6000 pilots, and I can guarantee you that if we grow by 6000 it will not be organically.
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Originally Posted by Check Essential
(Post 1187612)
That was my whole point. I was in denial I guess.
It didn't really sink in until I saw this Negotiator Notepad and then tonight when I logged on and read all the posts from you and especially alfaromeo. ALPA has accepted that "the world has changed". Its now a world where airline pilots make substantially less money than we used to make. The bankruptcy rates aren't some temporary emergency thing. They are the new baseline. "What we used to make is irrelevant". I was still clinging to some faint hopes. Not anymore. We're not getting back to C2K during my career. And probably never. It just saddens me to see "airline pilot" drop so steeply in the hierarchy of respected and highly compensated professions in the world. |
Hockey,
Even I am not that pessimistic. |
Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
(Post 1187764)
I agree with this. If we do not merge with anyone else, I see us as a 7000 pilot workforce in 10 years. I will be at about number 6000. Pretty good. 15 years with the company to get to 6000 out of 7000 pilots during our period of massive retirements. We will have managed to avoid furloughing anyone during that time while our entire narrowbody fleet smaller than the 737-900 is outsourced. This is all speculation of course.
Relax! From your posts I gather that we're about the same demographic age/seniority-wise. I see the future as well within our control. Wait and see what comes out, if anything - then vote accordingly. Worst case scenario is that you're still young enough to jump ship if we "sell the farm." The sky's not falling yet :eek: |
Originally Posted by JungleBus
(Post 1187768)
ALPA has accepted it but I don't see such defeatism at the various CAPA airlines. I'm not sure DPA is the answer but I'm becoming more and more convinced that ALPA has become not only useless but actually counterproductive. Eight years ago, I was among ALPA's biggest cheerleaders. It's taken a lot to turn my view 180 degrees but ALPA has managed it. The sooner they die, the sooner we can work on effective replacements.
DAL: 18% NWA: 26% LUV: 7% CAL: 2% AMR: 1.5% UAL: 1.5% AAA: 0% So, just who are you referring to? |
Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
(Post 1187764)
I agree with this. If we do not merge with anyone else, I see us as a 7000 pilot workforce in 10 years. I will be at about number 6000. Pretty good. 15 years with the company to get to 6000 out of 7000 pilots during our period of massive retirements. We will have managed to avoid furloughing anyone during that time while our entire narrowbody fleet smaller than the 737-900 is outsourced. This is all speculation of course.
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Originally Posted by hockeypilot44
(Post 1187764)
I agree with this. If we do not merge with anyone else, I see us as a 7000 pilot workforce in 10 years. I will be at about number 6000. Pretty good. 15 years with the company to get to 6000 out of 7000 pilots during our period of massive retirements. We will have managed to avoid furloughing anyone during that time while our entire narrowbody fleet smaller than the 737-900 is outsourced. This is all speculation of course.
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Originally Posted by Pineapple Guy
(Post 1187774)
Oh really. Care to let a few facts be interjected? Here are the pay raises that have occurred at various airlines since 2008.
DAL: 18% NWA: 26% LUV: 7% CAL: 2% AMR: 1.5% UAL: 1.5% AAA: 0% So, just who are you referring to? |
Originally Posted by Pineapple Guy
(Post 1187774)
Oh really. Care to let a few facts be interjected? Here are the pay raises that have occurred at various airlines since 2008.
DAL: 18% NWA: 26% LUV: 7% CAL: 2% AMR: 1.5% UAL: 1.5% AAA: 0% So, just who are you referring to? OK - Great. Excellent choice of 2008 as a baseline. Pick 2004 or 2000 as a baseline and what results do you get. I will grant that we probably have fared better than the other carriers to visit BK (most who are also ALPA) - but picking our nadir as a baseline and then comparing it to SWA does not yield an accurate picture. Scoop |
If in case anyone hasn't mentioned it.....
If we get a crappy TA I'm voting for DPA:) Joking aside, any truth to the rumor that DALPA is looking to raise our dues this fall? And, any chance that even with the current NNP "concessionairy contract changes" that we may be getting some significan industry leading advancement in compensation in conjunction with some airtight section 1 scope? I pessimisticly doubt that, but wondering if that is a possibility. |
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