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Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)
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-   -   Details on Delta TA (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/88532-details-delta-ta.html)

DAL 88 Driver 08-29-2014 06:17 AM
Originally Posted by slowplay (Post 1715156)
It would be good if you'd hold yourself to that standard when posting.
I do. Show me an example where I lied about something.

Nice drive by, BTW. :rolleyes:

tonyp 08-29-2014 06:54 AM
Originally Posted by DAL 88 Driver (Post 1715148)
Just about everybody who is familiar and/or has firsthand experience with CDO's knows that most pilots do not sleep during the day and that they plan on getting their sleep during the break between flights at the hotel on the CDO.
:mad:
In my experience this is absolutely not the case. I have always napped when returning from these things and I think for the most part everyone else does too. "Most pilots do not sleep during the day"....absolutely no data indicates what you claim or what I claim either.

Dude..... I appreciate your opinion on many subjects but if you want people to consider your thoughts on C2015, you need to supply actual data not hearsay and emotional commentary.

Purple Drank 08-29-2014 06:56 AM
Originally Posted by tonyp (Post 1715181)
absolutely no data indicates what you claim.
how about personal experience, anecdotal evidence, and common sense?

tsquare 08-29-2014 06:59 AM
Originally Posted by tonyp (Post 1715181)
In my experience this is absolutely not the case. I have always napped when returning from these things and I think for the most part everyone else does too. "Most pilots do not sleep during the day"....absolutely no data indicates what you claim or what I claim also.

Dude..... I appreciate your opinion on many subjects but if you want people to consider your thoughts on C2015 you need to apply actual data, not hearsay and emotional commentary.
So does that mean that you are in favor of flying a couple of hours at 10pm, going to a hotel for a 3-4 hour nap then flying back?

DAL 88 Driver 08-29-2014 07:10 AM
Originally Posted by tonyp (Post 1715181)
In my experience this is absolutely not the case. I have always napped when returning from these things and I think for the most part everyone else does too. "Most pilots do not sleep during the day"....absolutely no data indicates what you claim or what I claim either.

Dude..... I appreciate your opinion on many subjects but if you want people to consider your thoughts on C2015, you need to supply actual data not hearsay and emotional commentary.
"Dude"... Just because there's not a study providing data doesn't mean something doesn't exist. I'm sure there are some CDO pilots who go home in the morning and take a nap. But they're still not getting anywhere near 8 hours of sleep in the 24 hour period. I'm sure there's also a rare pilot here or there who does get some significant sleep during the day, but my experience tells me that is the exception rather than the rule. And no, I don't have a freaking spreadsheet to prove it.

tonyp 08-29-2014 07:19 AM
Originally Posted by tsquare (Post 1715187)
So does that mean that you are in favor of flying a couple of hours at 10pm, going to a hotel for a 3-4 hour nap then flying back?
I hate to agree with Oberon but isn't that exactly what you do with your 76ER? Do you go to the hotel and sleep after an Atlantic crossing?

tonyp 08-29-2014 07:22 AM
Originally Posted by Purple Drank (Post 1715185)
how about personal experience, anecdotal evidence, and common sense?
Ok, because thats totally quantifiable.....I've lived it, have you?

Oberon 08-29-2014 07:32 AM
Originally Posted by DAL 88 Driver (Post 1715148)
That's a flat out lie. I didn't make anything up. Never said I made anything up. I stated what I have observed over the course of many years with my own two eyes and ears. I also stated what I observed when I flew a few CDO's back in the day. Just about everybody who is familiar and/or has firsthand experience with CDO's knows that most pilots do not sleep during the day and that they plan on getting their sleep during the break between flights at the hotel on the CDO. Just because there's not some study or statistic to support it, doesn't mean it's not a fact.

You can disagree with me all you want. We can debate this ad nauseum. But I will not tolerate you lying about what I have said. :mad:
It's not a lie. You made it up. Did you sleep during the day when you did CDOs? I did. Everyone I've ever flown with on a CDO says they did. My anecdotal evidence is the exact opposite of yours.

I invite anyone who flies CDOs and doesn't sleep during the day to post in support of your assertion. It's an anonymous service. Surely someone can add some evidence that "most pilots do not sleep during the day".

Purple Drank 08-29-2014 07:40 AM
Originally Posted by tonyp (Post 1715197)
Ok, because thats totally quantifiable.....I've lived it, have you?
lived what? CDOs? nope. never had to do them won't do them. Don't need to try them to know they're a bad idea for me. I won't let my family non-rev on CDO return legs.

have I done transoceanic flying? yep. lots of it. completely different animal for all of the reasons listed above. not sure how it's relevant, but thanks for asking.

tsquare 08-29-2014 07:51 AM
Originally Posted by tonyp (Post 1715196)
I hate to agree with Oberon but isn't that exactly what you do with your 76ER? Do you go to the hotel and sleep after an Atlantic crossing?
Apples and oranges. A 2 hour flight followed by 4 hours behind the door, followed by another 2 hour flight completely on the backside of the clock is different. A Europe trip has you landing at 3am or so body clock. That is vastly different than landing at 6am. A better analogy would be the allnighters from the west coast which I have also stated are extremely undesirable... You wanna look 70 when you are 55?


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