Originally Posted by ERflyer (Post 1875157)

I'm just trying to interject some realism. Restoration won't happen because your employer will never give it to you.

Originally Posted by ERflyer (Post 1875157)

I do want it but I know it'll never happen. Sorry. Reality sucks.

Originally Posted by ERflyer (Post 1875157)

Knowing that your employer won't give you a raise that would be 50% more than what its competitors pays their pilots leads to the next logical step: what tactic do I use to get the most I can?

Originally Posted by ERflyer (Post 1875157)

Your tactics, asking for unrealistic raises, in my opinion, will get me less money. I'm just stating what the better, realistic, tactic is to gain the largest pay raise I possibly can.

Originally Posted by Trip7 (Post 1875121)

Glad to see a few sharp pilots here realize that compound interest is the 8th wonder of the world. I'll take the 15% all day everyday

Originally Posted by Raging white (Post 1875169)

I'm curious, what evidence pdo you have that asking for "an unrealistic raise" will ultimately result in "less"? I'm interested in real life data, because this really seems like conjecture and emotional opinion, not fact based cause and effect.

Originally Posted by Purple Drank (Post 1875190)

At least Sleepy Ed had the stones to use his own name while trying to take food off of pilots' families' tables.

Here we've got ErFlyer, Karnak, trip7, sailingfun, and others who are attempting the same thing anonymously by doing everything they can to make sure we're paid as little as possible.

I take it personally. No different than a guy who sneaks into my home and steals my money or otherwise messes with my bread and butter.

Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 1874927)

Pilot Expectations are managed by the MEC. I guess you weren't at DL South for our 2000 negotiations. We had a great MEC Leader and Negotiators, and they spooled up the pilot group by educating them as to exactly how much we had given up in our previous contract in 1996, lovingly referred to as POS 96.

They had charts and graphs that showed how much more money Management was making in 2000, and how little the pilot group was making, and how far behind inflation we were, etc. In short, the MEC MOTIVATED the pilots to DEMAND RESTORATION, we even had tie tacks that said, "Restore the Profession". We did informational picketing, we had a strike vote, Labor Risk was definitely NOT off the table.

Fast forward 15 years. The Delta pilots have given BILLIONS in concessions, every year, for 11 years, to help save Delta. And now Delta is making BILLIONS.

But not a peep about Restoration from the MEC, as if the Lost Decade never even happened.

Why not? Why no family awareness meetings? Why no informational picketing? Why aren't we in RA's face about his 22% raise? Why aren't they raising pilot expectations right now, instead of lowering them?

What are they afraid of? The Media? The NMB? Both?

All they have to do is show the pilots and the media, and the NMB, the actual numbers for all the stuff we gave up in Bankruptcy to Save Delta; the 42% pay cuts, the retirement funding we lost, the jobs we eliminated with all of our efficiencies like PBS, the lost weeks of vacation, the outsourcing of our international flying with all the JV's, and how the company isn't even in compliance with the agreement they signed.

Yes, we have made small, incremental gains in the past 11 years, but we are still 18% behind 2004 pay rates, with very little in terms of retirement funding if you're in your mid to late 50's now, as so many of our pilots are.

It's payback time. Let's start acting like it. :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by TED74 (Post 1875204)

New to ALPA and new to Delta. I've also been wondering why I haven't heard or seen any of this from DALPA? I hear a LOT about the ME airline threat (legitimate), but nothing on what is just as important - the current negotiation and what we should be striving for. It's not the fight-for-me union I thought I was walking into. Seems like a personnel wing of the company itself.

Originally Posted by ERflyer (Post 1875189)

American rejects its pilots' contract plan - latimes

American Airlines pilots plan disruptions, not full strike - USATODAY.com

American asked for over 50% in 2008. They achieved their first raise in 2015. Meanwhile we had two contracts (where we asked for less) during that time that achieved pretty good increases in W-2. I'm making 56.7% more now than in 2009, same seat, same airplane, no green slips either year. (We all know we got wacked twice during bankruptcy.)

We're now going to get a third new contract with a nice raise - whatever it is. American is stuck with their contract until 2020. We'll probably get a fourth contract before they get another.

Based on this alone, what tactic do you think worked best? No emotion, no conjecture. Just facts.

Originally Posted by ERflyer (Post 1875202)

I believe it is you, Carl and a few others who are promoting tactics that will net us less money. Ironic isn't it? By asking for something unrealistic the opposing side digs in its heals and you get nothing. So who is it stealing money again? Or better yet, from naïveté and bluster, who would just fumble it away?

Originally Posted by ERflyer (Post 1875202)

I believe it is you, Carl and a few others who are promoting tactics that will net us less money. Ironic isn't it? By asking for something unrealistic the opposing side digs in its heals and you get nothing. So who is it stealing money again? Or better yet, from naïveté and bluster, who would just fumble it away?

See my above post.