Airline Pilot Central Forums - Details on Delta TA

Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)

- Delta (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/)

- - Details on Delta TA (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/delta/88532-details-delta-ta.html)

Who is the shadow MEC? Do they fly the line or are they paid for with dues money to do something else??

[QUOTE=Check Essential;1885627]I don't think so.
ALPA has to be worried they would not survive another C2012.

I have to disagree with this statement.

For a while I thought things had changed. The MEC Chairman and the NC were saying all the right things.

In reality nothing has changed. Donatelli has on his Tim O'Malley company hat. He is attempting to drive management's agenda with all his might.

The arrogance and ignorance of the insiders is unchecked. They have no fear and maybe they are right. Unless and until the line pilots recall the leaders who allow this behavior, nothing will change.

Just think how little respect management has for these guys. Just asking for more 76 seat jets for the DCI carriers is the ultimate insult.

What's next? Prima Nocta?

They can have more 76 seat jets at DCI as soon as we get their 700% compensation increases and they restore our DB plan.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timbo (Post 1885411)

New rumor:

Say good bye to dropping trips for IOE...

Funny how these rumors keep popping up, like 4,8,3,3 but then suddenly end up in our CBA.

Automatic NO vote for me!

If true and is ratified, I can guarantee at least one additional training cycle.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schwanker (Post 1885671)

Automatic NO vote for me!

If true and is ratified, I can guarantee at least one additional training cycle.

Which would be what?...

On a brighter note, we're getting a 5 cent increase in our hourly per diem.

Don't spend it all in one place.:rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by index (Post 1885638)

Is that the best you can come up with sailingfud? You act as if that's the only possible explanation; they're liars!

I have no doubt they were telling the truth. That doesn't mean THEY weren't lied to. Or maybe just not told the whole truth. If you think the MEC is running the show you are living in a fantasy world. The NC and Master Chairman, along with the Shadow MEC do. They are the real power players. The rest, like you and I, are along for the ride.

see above

Do you remember during the 777 negotiations when the MEC directed the NC to stop negotiating with the company on the 777, because the company was stonewalling? And then several weeks later Malone/Giambusso called a Special Meeting in Atlanta and, much to the surprise of the reps, announced that a TA had been reached on the 777??? All while no negotiations were going on. Amazing how that happened. How could that be sailingfud?

First off sailingfud, it's "were," not "we are."

The reps are the next last to know what's going on. We're the last. The Chief Pilots likely know more of what's going on at the table than the MEC.

Just like the rumor of 4/8/3/3 sailingfud. The agreement that you said would never pass. Until you advocated strongly for it.

Are you going to do the same thing again this time, or are you just going to come out of the chute strongly for it? What's your strategy this time? Going to mix it up or go with what worked last time?

Ok, I posted where my info came from as did other pilots. Can you tell us where the info you have is from that compensation proposals were exchanged back then.
As far as contract 2012 I can't say I was a strong advocate for it and did not change my vote until the last day to a yes after a long discussion with a member of the negotiating committee. What I did try and do is educate myself and clarify some of the wild stuff posted on here.
In the end the yes vote turned out far better then I could have imagined at the time and is directly responsible for us now being in the most favorable negotiating climate in the last 15 years.
Funny that a quick glance at any avaition web board shows Delta is the place people want to be. Strange how that happened!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schwanker (Post 1885671)

Automatic NO vote for me!

If true and is ratified, I can guarantee at least one additional training cycle.

X2..I can't imagine why any FO would vote yes for a TA that contained a change to LCA bidding...All the junior FO's will be senior soon and will wish they still had the current format.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3 green (Post 1885750)

X2..I can't imagine why any FO would vote yes for a TA that contained a change to LCA bidding...All the junior FO's will be senior soon and will wish they still had the current format.

This doesn't just affect senior F/Os. It affects all of them. Not all LCA are senior. Trips that are removed from availability to be bid completely abrogates the system. All to be approved by our union.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailingfun (Post 1885725)

Ok, I posted where my info came from as did other pilots. Can you tell us where the info you have is from that compensation proposals were exchanged back then.
As far as contract 2012 I can't say I was a strong advocate for it and did not change my vote until the last day to a yes after a long discussion with a member of the negotiating committee. What I did try and do is educate myself and clarify some of the wild stuff posted on here.
In the end the yes vote turned out far better then I could have imagined at the time and is directly responsible for us now being in the most favorable negotiating climate in the last 15 years.
Funny that a quick glance at any avaition web board shows Delta is the place people want to be. Strange how that happened!

It's always ironic that any pilot who dares to opine, challenge, or otherwise question the directional intent taken by DALPA leadership is accused of acting on haste, emotion, and/or irrational, but ardent supporters, such as yourself, continually purport statements as bold-faced above.

Why should we, as pilots, care that DAL is currently a first choice of pilot applicants? Every legacy/major was at one pont the "place to be". So should we be prideful and proud that we are at a company that other pilots would like to work. Does it provide you some comfort that others wish to be in your shoes

Doesn't sound much like a rational, unemotional perspective if you ask me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Army80 (Post 1885103)

Carl,

Maybe the company:

1. Wants to get profit sharing for all the help reduced.

No maybe about it. The evidence has been overwhelming for over six months now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Army80 (Post 1885103)

2. They believe that in order to accomplish #1, they need to start with the pilots. (The other groups can be done without negotiating) The optics of cutting the non union profit sharing, without cutting the pilot's profit sharing, could be pretty ugly.

Again, no maybe about it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Army80 (Post 1885103)

3. A contract that adds cost to the pilot group can be offset by the savings garnered from the rest of the employee's profit sharing reduction. Even though the rest of workers will probably see a pay increase, it can be sold in with smoke and mirrors to look like it's a net gain.

This is precisely what happened in C2012. Our contract not only was cost neutral to Delta, it provided so much savings that management was able to use those savings to fund initiatives that benefitted OTHER employee groups at Delta. Source: RA and Ed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Army80 (Post 1885103)

I don't see the company's desire to get a quick deal as an automatically bad deal for us.

Again, their duty is to get the lowest possible cost for us. If they were dragging their feet, it would be for the purpose of getting the lowest cost. If they are hurrying, it's for the purpose of getting the lowest possible cost. They happen to be in a rush now. And now you know why they're in a rush.

Carl