OK, what about if profit drops to zero? This is just like the whole bigger pays more argument. For the life of me I cannot understand why you people want to put MORE of the items that determine our pay into other peoples' hands. We fly airplanes. Period. We do not buy them, nor do we schedule/deploy them. If you are going to include PS in compensation comparisons, you better damned well include the shared reward bonuses as well. $1000/year? Since bigger pays more, why aren't 747/777s getting MORE shared rewards? Then why is PS a percentage? It is not a standard payout that can be counted on, and that's precisely the point. Monitize it, that's fine, but it MUST be over and above any pay increases.

Oooooooo that's goooood.

Profit sharing is "at risk" compensation. Its there in good times, and dries up in bad times. Its is perplexing that DAL or any airline for that matter would want to go to fixed pay versus "at risk" pay.

Say we get a 10% check this year, and next year the airline's profits reduce by 50%, that is a 5% paycut to the pilots without having to negotiate anything. Variable compensation works very well to avoid messy concessionary talks for a company, but it provides bad press for the airline managers who get hit by Wall Street for no other reason than they don't like seeing 1 billion a year given to those darn employees.

I am sure they would see it differently if they were paying that in wages and then the company had to destroy a relationship with the "de-risked" pilots to get some of it back if the airline went in to the red.


Its easy to agree to when the number are not there, but when they show up, they seem to have a hard time defending it. Rinse, wash repeat.

Then you get nothing. It's like investing in the stock market to an extent. You take a higher risk, and you put that risk in the hands of others. Odds are you'll make more than you would with a guaranteed return such as a CD, but you could also lose money.

Who people? This is just me talking.

True. But we do have the ability to operate those aircraft more efficiently, more comfortably, and more satisfactorily to our customers. Timely PAs when something has gone wrong, a smile and kind word here and there, a pair of wings to one of our youngest passengers. These each play a tiny part in the overall success of the enterprise.

That said, if you want less at risk compensation, I certainly understand that point of view.

I think I saw it in the comparison that just came out.

Yup....
If PS is to be considered as comparable compensation to other airlines, the fact that it is at risk has to be considered. Our base pay rates are the ones in which we are seeking an increase. 12% is my number. If you want to give me an additional X% increase based on the payouts we have had in the past few years in addition to our base compensation, then cool. I'm onboard with that. I guess since it has amounted to approximately another month's pay, that is an additional 8.3%. I'll let 'em round down to an even 20% starting, and then go with CPI index +1% increase after that.

Agreed....

For that next year, yes.

No. It is just an attempt by PD to try and make it seem like that anyone who has different/opposing positions, must be on FPL/Dalpa insider, to justify to himself (and any lurkers) the fact many on here (and at Delta as a whole) don't agree with him.

What other justification would he have to always throw that dart?

I'll give you that, except that I can choose which stocks to invest in, and when to sell the dogs and either cut my losses or capture my gains. I have to wait for a full year in order to capture any gains, and I have no recourse to capture something if management makes really stupid decisions in the interim.

You're not alone in this monitization desire.



Not always. I flew a goat rope all nighter from SMF to ATL the other night that I have a 2 page FCR and letter to the station manager in work. Minimal catering, no liquor, no sodas, snacks or blankets. I can only control so much, and in many cases I wind up apologizing for crap that I had nothing to do with or more importantly, no way to rectify. But my FAs and I are left with irate and unhappy customers for the next 6 hours. At least the landing was good. (Not mine) This is more of the same in a sense except that I am being asked to pay for those blankets and liquor.

I think I have made my point clear on this. During the course of the upcoming contract, I will gladly take this risk. It was premature to sell half of our last PS for "monitization".

disposted............