Attitude
08-14-2018, 02:59 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2015
Posts: 641
They aren’t negative attitudes due to negative people. These posts come from experience and management culture. Non creative welcome aboard. Please reread this thread in six months to a year for perspective
“because I'm trying to stick up for a company who I believe in and trying to get me to turn away hurts Envoy,”
Envoy management turned their back on 1000 pilots a few years ago and told them to restart at psa or piedmont. Your not going to make a hurt difference.
“because I'm trying to stick up for a company who I believe in and trying to get me to turn away hurts Envoy,”
Envoy management turned their back on 1000 pilots a few years ago and told them to restart at psa or piedmont. Your not going to make a hurt difference.
08-14-2018, 04:53 AM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,659
While I am somewhat new to the company I can wholeheartedly say that you shouldn’t be sticking up for this company, or any airline really. There is a sharp divide between Managment and labor and the company will not stick up for you beyond what they are legally required too. Your Union is the one that does that, in therory.
Anyway, I have had a fantastic experience with Envoy crews so far, so don’t misinterpret what people are saying. Lots of the posters on here were around during the **** days and watched the company screw them over without mercy, so while you have a very optimistic and positive approach to it, others see the writing on the wall.
My biggest fear as that all of this optimism and positive advancement is going to make our pilot group complacent and when things go to hell, which they will again, we won’t have any seasoned union guys/gals to step up.
It’s easy to be rosy and starry eyed when the company is throwing money around but understand, the very moment they don’t have to, they won’t. The company is playing nice for their benefit, not ours.
Lastly, like I said, I have had a great experience and hope it continues, just don’t come on here expecting those that have seen the dark side to just roll over.
Anyway, I have had a fantastic experience with Envoy crews so far, so don’t misinterpret what people are saying. Lots of the posters on here were around during the **** days and watched the company screw them over without mercy, so while you have a very optimistic and positive approach to it, others see the writing on the wall.
My biggest fear as that all of this optimism and positive advancement is going to make our pilot group complacent and when things go to hell, which they will again, we won’t have any seasoned union guys/gals to step up.
It’s easy to be rosy and starry eyed when the company is throwing money around but understand, the very moment they don’t have to, they won’t. The company is playing nice for their benefit, not ours.
Lastly, like I said, I have had a great experience and hope it continues, just don’t come on here expecting those that have seen the dark side to just roll over.
08-14-2018, 07:48 AM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2016
Position: FO
Posts: 793
Attitude
Originally Posted by UncreativeUser
This.
I've been looking forward to coming to Envoy for about a year or so now after finally reaching minimums I'm going into the next class as a cadet. Usually, I just read posts but now I am having second thoughts about coming here because there are fellow pilots on here that decide to post threads bashing some guy with a vlog.
Is this a joke? I really would like to know what it is that makes the pilots on this particular forum so salty about everything, it's very off-putting coming to an airline I'm excited to join just to find pilot's continuously complaining about everything. I don't see this even see this kind of behavior on Mesa's forums, it's pathetic.
I'm not saying that everything about Envoy is peachy perfect, nor am I saying that I am an always "positive vibes" kind of guy. But this kind of negative bull**** has to stop. From what I hear in person, Envoy is still considered a top-tier regional.
It is evident by the fact that we started a thread bashing someone with hopes and dreams to fly for the airlines, just like the rest of us. It is evident that we have a program like a flow that doesn't work in their favor because it is not quick enough. The flow thing isn't even designed to be your only hope to getting into the majors yet there are pilots on here that bash it probably because they can't get in without it (which is fine but respect the process).
Writing on this forum won't do much, I have listed concerns to management and they actually tend to listen to ideas if you take the time to let them know. That is one of the strongest ways to change a company besides complaining on the sidelines.
As to that thread, yes I have met Swayne and he is not as much of a douche as I initially thought he was. But I still would have posted this anyways even if he was.
If there are issues, let's work together as a team. I understand the need to vent, but we can always think together and generate ideas that can make Envoy better than it is instead of getting behind a keyboard and venting to people who are just as powerless as I am to change anything.
I've been looking forward to coming to Envoy for about a year or so now after finally reaching minimums I'm going into the next class as a cadet. Usually, I just read posts but now I am having second thoughts about coming here because there are fellow pilots on here that decide to post threads bashing some guy with a vlog.
Is this a joke? I really would like to know what it is that makes the pilots on this particular forum so salty about everything, it's very off-putting coming to an airline I'm excited to join just to find pilot's continuously complaining about everything. I don't see this even see this kind of behavior on Mesa's forums, it's pathetic.
I'm not saying that everything about Envoy is peachy perfect, nor am I saying that I am an always "positive vibes" kind of guy. But this kind of negative bull**** has to stop. From what I hear in person, Envoy is still considered a top-tier regional.
It is evident by the fact that we started a thread bashing someone with hopes and dreams to fly for the airlines, just like the rest of us. It is evident that we have a program like a flow that doesn't work in their favor because it is not quick enough. The flow thing isn't even designed to be your only hope to getting into the majors yet there are pilots on here that bash it probably because they can't get in without it (which is fine but respect the process).
Writing on this forum won't do much, I have listed concerns to management and they actually tend to listen to ideas if you take the time to let them know. That is one of the strongest ways to change a company besides complaining on the sidelines.
As to that thread, yes I have met Swayne and he is not as much of a douche as I initially thought he was. But I still would have posted this anyways even if he was.
If there are issues, let's work together as a team. I understand the need to vent, but we can always think together and generate ideas that can make Envoy better than it is instead of getting behind a keyboard and venting to people who are just as powerless as I am to change anything.
Bravo!!! I felt the same as you, not knowing the guy, I felt bad reading some of the post about the guy! It makes this REGIONAL AIRLINE look really bad and unprofessional to bad mouth someone publicly or publicly try to shame him without knowing him or who he is as a person. It’s unprofessional.
When I first came here it was the culture and image of eagle pilots I admired most, along with bonus, better pay, half a decade land of milk & honey flow.
But there are folks here that think just because they have been here XX amount of years (too long), their voice is greater and grander than someone else and that humble factor that is a admirable character is non-existent. I respect longevity I really do. But to tarnish another persons character out of JEALOUSY is very tacky, unprofessional, and lady dog (bishhy).
Op, pass on to Swayne & to you also that online perspective of a few are not a indication of the large majority or the masses! Welcome Onboard! Large Majority of the pilots on here and in the fleet is and will be very glad to have you & looking forward to flying with you and hearing of the overall life experiences you’ve had.
I too felt sick reading posts on here abt that guy, I had log in issues and could not post,. And quite frankly I was sick of reading the haters & jealous folks posts, I took a break from APC, and went back to “JC” com where the overall pilots there are a lot more professional & with character.
These online forums can be depressing and harsh and not reflect reality sometime. Overall there are many things such as Reserve rules and pay/soft pay, QOL issues that need fixing, but overall, I have to say this Airline (due to industry trends and pressure) is a much better place to work than years ago.
The industry is changing so fast OP, continue to think long-term if you were stuck at a regional where would you go, since it will not always be roses! Continue to ask yourself, outside the flow (pay, QOL, crap Flight files and schedules from mainline, health care, Retirement, 401K, soft pay, contract language, 12yr+ CA Pay long term if you were stuck here), would you come here ? Or go to Endeavor, Republic, Air Wisconsin, (or even Piedmont with 300% OT), etc. overall, something for all interested to consider.
Your a good person for standing up to the inter-web text bullies!
Last edited by SilentLurker; 08-14-2018 at 08:28 AM.
08-17-2018, 12:37 AM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2009
Posts: 2,035
Originally Posted by UncreativeUser
Lol I got off of your guy's kool-aid real quick thankfully.
Personally, never touch the stuff myself(doesn't mix well with Bacardi or Vodka)...
Last edited by Paid2fly; 08-17-2018 at 01:05 AM.
08-21-2018, 09:02 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Dec 2017
Posts: 467
Originally Posted by SilentLurker
Bravo!!! I felt the same as you, not knowing the guy, I felt bad reading some of the post about the guy! It makes this REGIONAL AIRLINE look really bad and unprofessional to bad mouth someone publicly or publicly try to shame him without knowing him or who he is as a person. It’s unprofessional.
When I first came here it was the culture and image of eagle pilots I admired most, along with bonus, better pay, half a decade land of milk & honey flow.
But there are folks here that think just because they have been here XX amount of years (too long), their voice is greater and grander than someone else and that humble factor that is a admirable character is non-existent. I respect longevity I really do. But to tarnish another persons character out of JEALOUSY is very tacky, unprofessional, and lady dog (bishhy).
Op, pass on to Swayne & to you also that online perspective of a few are not a indication of the large majority or the masses! Welcome Onboard! Large Majority of the pilots on here and in the fleet is and will be very glad to have you & looking forward to flying with you and hearing of the overall life experiences you’ve had.
I too felt sick reading posts on here abt that guy, I had log in issues and could not post,. And quite frankly I was sick of reading the haters & jealous folks posts, I took a break from APC, and went back to “JC” com where the overall pilots there are a lot more professional & with character.
These online forums can be depressing and harsh and not reflect reality sometime. Overall there are many things such as Reserve rules and pay/soft pay, QOL issues that need fixing, but overall, I have to say this Airline (due to industry trends and pressure) is a much better place to work than years ago.
The industry is changing so fast OP, continue to think long-term if you were stuck at a regional where would you go, since it will not always be roses! Continue to ask yourself, outside the flow (pay, QOL, crap Flight files and schedules from mainline, health care, Retirement, 401K, soft pay, contract language, 12yr+ CA Pay long term if you were stuck here), would you come here ? Or go to Endeavor, Republic, Air Wisconsin, (or even Piedmont with 300% OT), etc. overall, something for all interested to consider.
Your a good person for standing up to the inter-web text bullies!
When I first came here it was the culture and image of eagle pilots I admired most, along with bonus, better pay, half a decade land of milk & honey flow.
But there are folks here that think just because they have been here XX amount of years (too long), their voice is greater and grander than someone else and that humble factor that is a admirable character is non-existent. I respect longevity I really do. But to tarnish another persons character out of JEALOUSY is very tacky, unprofessional, and lady dog (bishhy).
Op, pass on to Swayne & to you also that online perspective of a few are not a indication of the large majority or the masses! Welcome Onboard! Large Majority of the pilots on here and in the fleet is and will be very glad to have you & looking forward to flying with you and hearing of the overall life experiences you’ve had.
I too felt sick reading posts on here abt that guy, I had log in issues and could not post,. And quite frankly I was sick of reading the haters & jealous folks posts, I took a break from APC, and went back to “JC” com where the overall pilots there are a lot more professional & with character.
These online forums can be depressing and harsh and not reflect reality sometime. Overall there are many things such as Reserve rules and pay/soft pay, QOL issues that need fixing, but overall, I have to say this Airline (due to industry trends and pressure) is a much better place to work than years ago.
The industry is changing so fast OP, continue to think long-term if you were stuck at a regional where would you go, since it will not always be roses! Continue to ask yourself, outside the flow (pay, QOL, crap Flight files and schedules from mainline, health care, Retirement, 401K, soft pay, contract language, 12yr+ CA Pay long term if you were stuck here), would you come here ? Or go to Endeavor, Republic, Air Wisconsin, (or even Piedmont with 300% OT), etc. overall, something for all interested to consider.
Your a good person for standing up to the inter-web text bullies!
Thank you, I appreciate that! Idk I feel bad about the past guys but they like to take it out on the younger crowd as if we were at fault for the industry is the way it is today.
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08-21-2018, 09:06 PM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Dec 2017
Posts: 467
Originally Posted by Paid2fly
Personally, never touch the stuff myself(doesn't mix well with Bacardi or Vodka)...
Have you tried Grey Goose? You might like that if you could afford it with that Skywest pay (sorry I just had to get a jab in there couldn't pass up that opportunity
)Seriously though, I hope you guys do get a better contract soon.
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08-22-2018, 01:58 PM
#28
Line Holder
Joined APC: Nov 2017
Posts: 58
Being so idealistic is commendable. Like rookie police officers. Ready to save the world. The one thing I always like to caution. It’s just a job. No one owes you a thing. So when you get let down by something or you get jammed up...it’s business as usual. Keep your head up and ride out. Because big corporations are too big to fail and “camaraderie” is an old word that isn’t really used much anymore unfortunately.
08-27-2018, 03:09 PM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Dec 2017
Posts: 467
Originally Posted by bklynbacon
Being so idealistic is commendable. Like rookie police officers. Ready to save the world. The one thing I always like to caution. It’s just a job. No one owes you a thing. So when you get let down by something or you get jammed up...it’s business as usual. Keep your head up and ride out. Because big corporations are too big to fail and “camaraderie” is an old word that isn’t really used much anymore unfortunately.
True. But if they **** everyone off collectively only then will it become a problem, which I don’t think they are trying to actively do. To me I hope this isn’t a job because I’m very passionate about flying in general and that’s not working to me. It’s just depressing seeing guys who have given up to come on here and rip on a company that isn’t even that bad
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08-27-2018, 03:32 PM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2015
Posts: 687
Originally Posted by UncreativeUser
True. But if they **** everyone off collectively only then will it become a problem, which I don’t think they are trying to actively do. To me I hope this isn’t a job because I’m very passionate about flying in general and that’s not working to me. It’s just depressing seeing guys who have given up to come on here and rip on a company that isn’t even that bad
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