Envoy to get 100% flow to AA.
07-31-2015 | 06:19 AM
#262
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 3,578
Likes: 48
From: Semi-Retired...
07-31-2015 | 06:23 AM
#263
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Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 749
Likes: 0
Since 2013 envoy has sent 67% of all new hires to AA. What pile do you want to be in? The guaranteed flow? Or the 10,000 other guys with the same quals? Coming to envoy right now would be a good move for prospective new hires. It might take some time in the beginning. However, envoy beats working for outfits that are less safe and could wind up getting you violated on your quest for the magical 1,000 hours of TPIC.
The flow(s) were not crafted as some kind of benevolent gift to envoy and Piedmont pilots, rewarding them for slogging through 3 to 6 years (or 16 years as is currently the case) at their regional airline(s). No. It was designed to replace $125,000/year Captains with $65,000/year Captains and to replace $60,000 (9 year) First Officers with brand new $22,000 First Officers.
Why would mainline AAG hire from their own regionals instead of recruiting pilots from XJT, RAH, SKW, Commutair, Horizon, etc. in addition to the military and a plethora of 135 and corporate outfits? They have chosen to take financial advantage of the situation and move (a.k.a. "flow") their own highly-paid 16-year regional Captains over the mainline, (where their pay will initially be cut about in half), while drastically reducing pilot labor costs at their regionals.
Now for the news that no one wants to admit: once AAG has maximized their regional pilot cost reductions, via the "flow" and the 12/4 paycaps,...... the flow will slow to a trickle,...... flowing just enough pilots to mainline to keep their regional pilot costs as low as possible.
Do you think Parker, Kirby, Glass, et. al. invented the "flows" because they're nice guys?!?!?! Don't be a fool. They crafted the flow in order to maximize profits and maximize their bonus checks and stock options.
Many of you have written "don't chase the quick upgrade". I say "don't chase the flow!"
07-31-2015 | 06:24 AM
#264
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 569
Likes: 0
220 is the number. If they don't flow 220, then no pay caps that year. Unlike the March TA, under the Dec TA if the flow doesn't work by sending at least 220 each year, we still have our old pay steps.
This "snap back" type of step up only applies to those in property at DOS. So it's not perfect.
This "snap back" type of step up only applies to those in property at DOS. So it's not perfect.
07-31-2015 | 07:05 AM
#265
Does NOT get weekends off
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,631
Likes: 0
From: ERJ - 145
07-31-2015 | 07:44 AM
#267
Does NOT get weekends off
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,631
Likes: 0
From: ERJ - 145
The numbered guys I am not sure about - they might be a little different but still their DOH at Eagle does not translate to a DOH over at AA.
07-31-2015 | 06:56 PM
#268
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 224
Likes: 0
From: AE ERJ FO
Are you really that gullible or are you just trying to "sell" envoy to potential new hires for your own personal benefit?
The flow(s) were not crafted as some kind of benevolent gift to envoy and Piedmont pilots, rewarding them for slogging through 3 to 6 years (or 16 years as is currently the case) at their regional airline(s). No. It was designed to replace $125,000/year Captains with $65,000/year Captains and to replace $60,000 (9 year) First Officers with brand new $22,000 First Officers.
Why would mainline AAG hire from their own regionals instead of recruiting pilots from XJT, RAH, SKW, Commutair, Horizon, etc. in addition to the military and a plethora of 135 and corporate outfits? They have chosen to take financial advantage of the situation and move (a.k.a. "flow") their own highly-paid 16-year regional Captains over the mainline, (where their pay will initially be cut about in half), while drastically reducing pilot labor costs at their regionals.
Now for the news that no one wants to admit: once AAG has maximized their regional pilot cost reductions, via the "flow" and the 12/4 paycaps,...... the flow will slow to a trickle,...... flowing just enough pilots to mainline to keep their regional pilot costs as low as possible.
Do you think Parker, Kirby, Glass, et. al. invented the "flows" because they're nice guys?!?!?! Don't be a fool. They crafted the flow in order to maximize profits and maximize their bonus checks and stock options.
Many of you have written "don't chase the quick upgrade". I say "don't chase the flow!"
The flow(s) were not crafted as some kind of benevolent gift to envoy and Piedmont pilots, rewarding them for slogging through 3 to 6 years (or 16 years as is currently the case) at their regional airline(s). No. It was designed to replace $125,000/year Captains with $65,000/year Captains and to replace $60,000 (9 year) First Officers with brand new $22,000 First Officers.
Why would mainline AAG hire from their own regionals instead of recruiting pilots from XJT, RAH, SKW, Commutair, Horizon, etc. in addition to the military and a plethora of 135 and corporate outfits? They have chosen to take financial advantage of the situation and move (a.k.a. "flow") their own highly-paid 16-year regional Captains over the mainline, (where their pay will initially be cut about in half), while drastically reducing pilot labor costs at their regionals.
Now for the news that no one wants to admit: once AAG has maximized their regional pilot cost reductions, via the "flow" and the 12/4 paycaps,...... the flow will slow to a trickle,...... flowing just enough pilots to mainline to keep their regional pilot costs as low as possible.
Do you think Parker, Kirby, Glass, et. al. invented the "flows" because they're nice guys?!?!?! Don't be a fool. They crafted the flow in order to maximize profits and maximize their bonus checks and stock options.
Many of you have written "don't chase the quick upgrade". I say "don't chase the flow!"
08-01-2015 | 05:16 AM
#269
Line Holder
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 749
Likes: 0
If AA is still hiring, they will have a tough time in front of a judge denying the contractual guaranteed flow. Are you really so gullible that anyone with an ATP and 1,000 hours of TPIC will get hired by a major? It's going to take more than that. Especially with the wholly owned carriers occupying half or more of the available slots.
If Parker and the boys really wanted to move their "best and brightest" to the big leagues,....... why would the contract severely limit the number of Envoy and PDT pilots moving over to mainline? And why do you suppose Parker and the boys fought *SO* hard for the 12/4 pay caps, especially if they never intended to have a lot of pilots up against those caps?
Envoy and Piedmont have very senior and EXPENSIVE pilot groups. The flows are designed and calculated to minimize regional pilot labor costs,...... not reward pilots for their loyalty.
Airlines trample on labor contracts on a daily basis. When minimum pilot labor costs at the wholly-owned regional airlines are achieved, they'll find ways to reduce those flows to a trickle. Sure, you can file a grievance but they'll drag that out for years, and in the meantime they'll save millions of dollars.
Last edited by Slick111; 08-01-2015 at 05:31 AM.
08-01-2015 | 06:02 AM
#270
Line Holder
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 43
Likes: 0
From: DHC-8 FO
Are you really that gullible or are you just trying to "sell" envoy to potential new hires for your own personal benefit?
The flow(s) were not crafted as some kind of benevolent gift to envoy and Piedmont pilots, rewarding them for slogging through 3 to 6 years (or 16 years as is currently the case) at their regional airline(s). No. It was designed to replace $125,000/year Captains with $65,000/year Captains and to replace $60,000 (9 year) First Officers with brand new $22,000 First Officers.
Why would mainline AAG hire from their own regionals instead of recruiting pilots from XJT, RAH, SKW, Commutair, Horizon, etc. in addition to the military and a plethora of 135 and corporate outfits? They have chosen to take financial advantage of the situation and move (a.k.a. "flow") their own highly-paid 16-year regional Captains over the mainline, (where their pay will initially be cut about in half), while drastically reducing pilot labor costs at their regionals.
Now for the news that no one wants to admit: once AAG has maximized their regional pilot cost reductions, via the "flow" and the 12/4 paycaps,...... the flow will slow to a trickle,...... flowing just enough pilots to mainline to keep their regional pilot costs as low as possible.
Do you think Parker, Kirby, Glass, et. al. invented the "flows" because they're nice guys?!?!?! Don't be a fool. They crafted the flow in order to maximize profits and maximize their bonus checks and stock options.
Many of you have written "don't chase the quick upgrade". I say "don't chase the flow!"
The flow(s) were not crafted as some kind of benevolent gift to envoy and Piedmont pilots, rewarding them for slogging through 3 to 6 years (or 16 years as is currently the case) at their regional airline(s). No. It was designed to replace $125,000/year Captains with $65,000/year Captains and to replace $60,000 (9 year) First Officers with brand new $22,000 First Officers.
Why would mainline AAG hire from their own regionals instead of recruiting pilots from XJT, RAH, SKW, Commutair, Horizon, etc. in addition to the military and a plethora of 135 and corporate outfits? They have chosen to take financial advantage of the situation and move (a.k.a. "flow") their own highly-paid 16-year regional Captains over the mainline, (where their pay will initially be cut about in half), while drastically reducing pilot labor costs at their regionals.
Now for the news that no one wants to admit: once AAG has maximized their regional pilot cost reductions, via the "flow" and the 12/4 paycaps,...... the flow will slow to a trickle,...... flowing just enough pilots to mainline to keep their regional pilot costs as low as possible.
Do you think Parker, Kirby, Glass, et. al. invented the "flows" because they're nice guys?!?!?! Don't be a fool. They crafted the flow in order to maximize profits and maximize their bonus checks and stock options.
Many of you have written "don't chase the quick upgrade". I say "don't chase the flow!"
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