HvypurplePylot

You do realize we don't have the pilots or planes to do that work right? I agree the check in the mail is getting old. As much as I don't like seeing the WGA tails out there, according to the SIG notes we don't have any more room left for days off in most bid packs.

fly2ski

[QUOTE=fishn;3283584]No I average around 1100 pay hours per year but do a lot of hometown frontend/ backend deadhead trips with 36 to 48 hour hometown layovers. Most months I'm only in hotels 3 to 4 days. I am a night flyer.

FXLAX

Scope needs to incentivize management NOT to outsource.

Pilot shortage is entirely on management. They are in sole control over it and pilots have nothing they can do to change that. Similarly, as for aircraft, they have parked MD10s and left MD11s sit in storage this whole time until recently.
Post #1748
https://www.airliners.net/forum/view...35b3#p22918983

Not sure why pilots would make management’s faulty case for them?

FXLAX

[QUOTE=fishn;3283584]
It’s not like pax airline where block hours more closely correlate with credit hours. For example, one can do a MEM-STL-MEM hub turn and get 6 credit hours even though it’s only a couple hours of block.

Noworkallplay

Hasn't our Scope done exactly what it was built to do and de-incentivevise the company from using large amounts of wet lease aircraft? We only used 3 or 4 wet leases a month correct? So if the language wasn’t working would we not see much larger use of wet lease. During Covid I think the company could’ve found a bunch of empty passenger airplane sitting around to do the work we do if it was cheaper. Instead we gained huge amounts of flight hours, hired like crazy, received numerous new 767’s and ordered a bunch more.

FXLAX

My understanding is that the wet lease clause was to allow management to cope with the surge of peak with a few aircraft and other contingencies like COVID with penalties apparently small enough for them to continue at will. So it appears that wasn’t entirely the case. Instead they parked airplanes and didn’t return others when demand was up while outsourcing. Either way you look at it, we have the opportunity to learn and improve that part of the contract.

HvypurplePylot

Have you seen how many pilots the school house is putting out? I would be concerned if we weren't hiring record numbers. We literally don't have the capability to fly these flights. You could say management should have planned better and hired more but that's easy to say looking back now. A couple years ago we were buying up lines.

FXLAX

If the language was tighter, they would’ve been hiring more for longer. It would’ve given the incentive for this hiring earlier if they knew they couldn’t just outsource like they currently doing. They wouldn’t have parked MD11s and have them sit until a few months ago when they pulled the first one out of storage, etc etc. You get the idea. Management operates under the allowances of the contract, trip build, optimizing, scheduling, revisions, and outsourcing. They know ahead of time all the contractual requirements and make decisions accordingly. Everything that has happened in reference to scope, parking aircraft, letting them sit for 18 months, hiring, increasing throughput, etc is all preplanned and predicated on the contract. All I’m saying is that their decisions would’ve been different if they didn’t have “outs” in the contract. So this is how it’s turned out now but imagine if scope was tighter? We can’t do anything about the past, but we have an opportunity to make it better during negotiations.

HvypurplePylot

I would like to see the scope language improved and certainly not weaker. My point being if we were any fatter on pilots in spring of 2020 without covid we had a really chance of being in 4.a.2.b.

Noworkallplay

What? “If the language was tighter it would have made them hire for longer”? So we would be forced to furlough in 2019 or any time business slows down slightly. Ask United about staffing formula requirements and how that affected furloughs in 08/09. Look at facts. We are only wet leasing 3-4 airplanes. Over peak we always use a few more. This isn't like we are subcontracting 50% of our feed like the pax airlines. I think our scope is doing precisely what it was meant to do.