yobob333

I am not impressed at all with state of our TA. Go back to the table! Peak is around the corner?

frozenboxhauler

And it's getting closer every day.

mcdbirdman

Which peak? Not this one. If we are lucky it MIGHT be next year. The time to "stop this train" was at the table before the MEC vote.

CloudSailor

We will get what we collectively believe we are worth.

For some reason, Delta has a culture where they know the great position they are in to negotiate, and they have chosen to stand up and proceed on the 'road less traveled', which is full of uncertainty, for the sense of value they provide to their company. Did their MEC and roadshows warn them that voting the TA down was a very bad idea? Of course. That's what roadshows are all about. Just wait for ours - the dissenting 30-50% will be beaten down to accept this is as good as it gets, or we will be risking the loss of everything we have ever had. From what I understand, ALPA was almost threatening when the notion of rejecting the TA came up (nothing like fear of the unknown to motivate the masses). That's what the roadshows are all about. As I have repeatedly said, I was at ALPA roadshows that sold PBS to a crew force willing to fully trust their leadership. The results after implementation were disastrous to QOL.

I hope our young guys here realize what we have lost, at the most prime time in negotiations we will likely ever see. And I hope that our guys here with 15-20+ years realize this is not what they have earned. From what I understand out on the line, this TA has the feel of 65% voting yes. It's as if all the guys who voted NO in the last 3 opportunities for improvements, have been beaten down to feel, "this is as good as it gets", and now guys in my seniority range, have taken their spot. I completely get it though, after 5 more years of hub turning, and no significant improvements (in my personal opinion), I will probably be numbed to this as well and feel, well... it's as good as it gets here, or - these concessions don't apply to me, so I just don't care.

My appreciation for the collective fortitude of the Delta pilot group has doubled in the last 3 days of discussions on this forum.

This is what we believe we are worth.

FDXLAG

Comparing Delta's TA to ours is a stretch. They literally bought their pay raise by giving up profit sharing, sick leave rights, and trips for FOs. With ours, I do not see any major give backs, granted there aren't many improvements, but no major give backs.

CloudSailor

Yeah, and comparing our balance sheet to Delta's in the last 15 years would also be a stretch, but we seem to do it.

I guess that's where the philosophical difference is, I see the fact that we don't have "many improvements" as you state as a huge concession during this environment.

But FDXLAG, "I'm not going to debate you" (line from 'Fargo' I love), I know where you stand. So, we will let the majority decide.

FDXLAG

I know you don't want to debate me before you debated me but a concession was giving up CGN for 2 three percent raises. It was a concession for DALPA to give up trips out of the FOs bid pack and profit sharing. It is not a concession to keep what you have and get some improvements.

But you don't know where I stand. Real time trip trading is a disappointment to me. No fix to sick notes is a disappointment to me. That being said with this TA I think Fedex Pilots are easily the most highly compensated in the industry and will be for at least the first 4 years of this contract. If after the TA is released I no longer think that I will vote no. Either way I will be fine with whatever the majority decides.
*by compensated I am not just talking pay.

mikecarr300

Can somebody give me one good reason why I should vote for this contract? I'm in no hurry to accept anything less than what we have earned.

FDXLAG

That is why they have roadshows.

mikecarr300

ROADSHOW = SALES PITCH
I'd rather hear the opinions of the actual line pilots