El Gipple

It didn't come into existence until 2010 as a result of the Affordable Care Act. Under the ACA, an employer can choose to offer medical insurance benefits only to employees and their dependent children, not to employees' spouses.

Back in 2013, I think UPS quit offering insurance to spouses who had access to it at their own job.

The problem with our CBA (and others) is there was no language precluding the Company from doing what they've done. So they did it and now the union gets to "negotiate" a solution in the new contract.

For some perspective, this is from a Forbes article back in 2015:

Not defending or rationalizing, just adding some perspective.

El Gipple

I might actually rationalize this one. I just checked my per-diem total for 2017 which ended up at $4,428. If I were paid $2.25/hr. (vs. the $1.90 I got), I'd have received $5,244 - an increase of $816.00 for the year (an extra $68/mo.). I've listened to guys claim they will vote NO because of the per-diem # TA'd and, I'll be honest, I was a little surprised by the # myself. BUT, I don't really give a $#!+ about how the shells are arranged on the table as long as I get enough of them. At the end of the day, it's about how much $$$$ ends up in the bank, right? If, at the final moment before TA'ing an entire deal, the Company said "hey, we were wondering if you might be interested in keeping the per-diem at $1.90/hr? If you do, we'll add an extra $5000 to each pilot's DC plan every year."

Would you still vote no because the per-diem is sub-standard?

If/when there is a TA to consider, what needs to be considered is the overall economic value it provides to you. Not whether the per-diem is equal to or more than your buddy at another airline. I hate to say it, but this isn't a d!ck measuring contest.

Would I like $2.25/hr in per-diem? Sure. Will it be a deal breaker for me? Not even close, unless of course, the rest of the economic package sucks too!

Good news is I'm pretty sure no one in the NC or MEC is going to send a POS TA to the pilots to vote on unless they too want it to fail.

ReserveCA

Really...
This is indigo.......... they will offer an extra $40 per month if we DROP perdiem to $1.75

Need a real job

🤣🤣🤣 feelin optimistic I see!!

Gary et al

SMH, you really have to argue with an accurate post like that. Sure indigo won't offer something good. But the point still stands, who cares what per diem is if the total package is there.

PulledBreaker

I care, because it'll be a constant daily reminder of how we have been utterly disrespected through this entire process. Market rate means market rate.

Gary et al

I care about market rate also but that post was all about hypotheticals. The total cost of market rate per diem is roughly $7-9 an hour depending on the yearly hours flown and other things. Are you saying you wouldn't accept removing per diem all together for an additional $15/hr? It's just math, and the more your numbers add up to the better it is, it doesn't matter where they come from. And, I'd argue per diem is worth even less as, if you can itemize your taxes, the less you are reimbursed by the company the more you can deduct. Again, basic math. For the most part I don't care how the money is organized as long as the total works out to the correct number.

CantStayAway

1) While the points on both side are valid, I wouldn’t accept 0 per diem. In economic times like these it’s easy to forget that we could be in bankruptcy in just 6 months from now. I’d be shocked if we were, but it’s not impossible. Would a bankruptcy judge force them to pay us per diem as he or she cut our pay by 30%? No. Same is true for PBS. If we give up our line bidding for higher rates and then go into bankruptcy, we won’t get line bidding back along with our pay cuts.

2) The tax deduction argument died with the new tax law. The shortage is no longer deductible.

V1 McFlyerson

I'm all for scoping out and evaluating the entire non-existent TA but right now all we've gotten so far is an agreed to industry-bottom per diem rate, HORRIBLE LTD, and spouse AND child surcharges for health insurance. It's not looking good, eh?

Missed Appch

Agreed. It is not looking good.