Hawaiian First Year Pay
09-27-2017, 10:32 PM
#31
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 59
Hawaiian First Year Pay
Originally Posted by harrier1231
I have a question. I currently live somewhere technically more expensive than HI. I've been saving all my pennies to afford my first year if I ever get on at HAL (hopefully they call first, but my app is in elsewhere because eggs, basket...)
I have a friend with a house on the big island. We go out there often, and I'm out there for my job often. People say to use an address on the island but what does that mean? Are they going to be mad when they find out it's my friend's vacation home? Is that too big of a risk since it isn't a huge tie? Should I just get a job at Island air for a year or so?
I have a friend with a house on the big island. We go out there often, and I'm out there for my job often. People say to use an address on the island but what does that mean? Are they going to be mad when they find out it's my friend's vacation home? Is that too big of a risk since it isn't a huge tie? Should I just get a job at Island air for a year or so?
I really don’t know if listing a hawaiian address will help or not. I’ve used my parent’s midwest address as my permanent address along with my foreign address (i was working for a foreign carrier) - and I got a call on the second try.
Just like any other interviews, it is my guess that telling truth will yield the best result for you. I’ve spent my teen life in the mainland but majority of my life i’ve lived in a foreign country with my entire prior experience with a foreign airline. I knew they’d prefer people with hawaiian ties but i just didn’t have any and tried another approach instead; explaining why my family and I need to be in hawaii. Fortunately for me the story fitted without giving any false, misleading details.
I understand your concern and why you are asking this kind of question though. It is without a doubt a very frustrating hiring practice for qualified guys from mainland - it’s just plain discriminatory. But at the same time I see a LOT of pilots here who are either from the mainland or with quite some mainland time in the past expressing their frustration (and anger) living in Hawaii. That of course will affect the overall pilot morale and the management clearly doesn’t want their pilots to be unhappy while working. So I understand where the management is coming from at the same time.
If I were you, I’d apply with only the truth showing on the resume. Frankly if your experience is good enough, i think the hiring dept will give you a call regardless of your address and it’s gonna be upto you convincing them why you are going to stay with HAL. Good luck in your future endeavors!
Last edited by leeaf7; 09-27-2017 at 10:45 PM.
09-28-2017, 09:36 AM
#32
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Posts: 239
Originally Posted by leeaf7
I really don’t know if listing a hawaiian address will help or not. I’ve used my parent’s midwest address as my permanent address along with my foreign address (i was working for a foreign carrier) - and I got a call on the second try.
Just like any other interviews, it is my guess that telling truth will yield the best result for you. I’ve spent my teen life in the mainland but majority of my life i’ve lived in a foreign country with my entire prior experience with a foreign airline. I knew they’d prefer people with hawaiian ties but i just didn’t have any and tried another approach instead; explaining why my family and I need to be in hawaii. Fortunately for me the story fitted without giving any false, misleading details.
I understand your concern and why you are asking this kind of question though. It is without a doubt a very frustrating hiring practice for qualified guys from mainland - it’s just plain discriminatory. But at the same time I see a LOT of pilots here who are either from the mainland or with quite some mainland time in the past expressing their frustration (and anger) living in Hawaii. That of course will affect the overall pilot morale and the management clearly doesn’t want their pilots to be unhappy while working. So I understand where the management is coming from at the same time.
If I were you, I’d apply with only the truth showing on the resume. Frankly if your experience is good enough, i think the hiring dept will give you a call regardless of your address and it’s gonna be upto you convincing them why you are going to stay with HAL. Good luck in your future endeavors!
Just like any other interviews, it is my guess that telling truth will yield the best result for you. I’ve spent my teen life in the mainland but majority of my life i’ve lived in a foreign country with my entire prior experience with a foreign airline. I knew they’d prefer people with hawaiian ties but i just didn’t have any and tried another approach instead; explaining why my family and I need to be in hawaii. Fortunately for me the story fitted without giving any false, misleading details.
I understand your concern and why you are asking this kind of question though. It is without a doubt a very frustrating hiring practice for qualified guys from mainland - it’s just plain discriminatory. But at the same time I see a LOT of pilots here who are either from the mainland or with quite some mainland time in the past expressing their frustration (and anger) living in Hawaii. That of course will affect the overall pilot morale and the management clearly doesn’t want their pilots to be unhappy while working. So I understand where the management is coming from at the same time.
If I were you, I’d apply with only the truth showing on the resume. Frankly if your experience is good enough, i think the hiring dept will give you a call regardless of your address and it’s gonna be upto you convincing them why you are going to stay with HAL. Good luck in your future endeavors!
I will second the truth sentiment. If you want to work here despite the Pilot-Management relationship I would stick to the truth. Plenty here with mainland only ties.
09-30-2017, 05:15 PM
#34
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2015
Position: Left
Posts: 1,807
Originally Posted by leeaf7
I am currently going through the first year; 717 side. About 85 hours of credit in average per month; take home is about 2400 a month.
1150 sqft apartment I am renting is $2500 a month (plus 400+ for utility) and that's not even close to the town (Honolulu) side.
They all show empathy toward the first year guys and their pay. But frankly that's all you are going to see. Like said above, why would you turn down your money for someone who's not even off probation yet?
I am slowly understanding why HAL's management has been focused on hiring guys having ties to HI. It's rough living out here and you won't last if you keep dwelling on that time you were back in the mainland without having nothing out here to cling onto. Even when you are making 150k or more, housing price nearing a million, private school costing 20k plus a year per kid and etc., you are still not going to quite get into that comfort zone. My wife and I (with kids) are still wondering if we could make ends meet on a second year pay when yearly min salary nears 100k already.
Don't get me wrong. It is still a good company imo and the pay is decent even after considering the hawaii cost of living. However, you'll just lose your sanity if you keep maintaining that false hope that your money would go just as far as your time back in mainland. Here things are just different and you must accept that fact to survive. That's the conclusion I came up with spending almost a year now.
1150 sqft apartment I am renting is $2500 a month (plus 400+ for utility) and that's not even close to the town (Honolulu) side.
They all show empathy toward the first year guys and their pay. But frankly that's all you are going to see. Like said above, why would you turn down your money for someone who's not even off probation yet?
I am slowly understanding why HAL's management has been focused on hiring guys having ties to HI. It's rough living out here and you won't last if you keep dwelling on that time you were back in the mainland without having nothing out here to cling onto. Even when you are making 150k or more, housing price nearing a million, private school costing 20k plus a year per kid and etc., you are still not going to quite get into that comfort zone. My wife and I (with kids) are still wondering if we could make ends meet on a second year pay when yearly min salary nears 100k already.
Don't get me wrong. It is still a good company imo and the pay is decent even after considering the hawaii cost of living. However, you'll just lose your sanity if you keep maintaining that false hope that your money would go just as far as your time back in mainland. Here things are just different and you must accept that fact to survive. That's the conclusion I came up with spending almost a year now.
10-04-2017, 09:56 AM
#35
On Reserve
Joined APC: Jun 2013
Position: Q400 FO
Posts: 40
Originally Posted by leeaf7
I understand your concern and why you are asking this kind of question though. It is without a doubt a very frustrating hiring practice for qualified guys from mainland - it’s just plain discriminatory. But at the same time I see a LOT of pilots here who are either from the mainland or with quite some mainland time in the past expressing their frustration (and anger) living in Hawaii. That of course will affect the overall pilot morale and the management clearly doesn’t want their pilots to be unhappy while working. So I understand where the management is coming from at the same time.
Could you elaborate mainlanders frustrations with living in Hawaii? Is it mostly cost of living issues, schools, and everything stated before or is there scheduling/job expectations that aren't being met? Assuming one moves there after first year is over, in your opinion what expectations would help a transitioning mainlander not be so unhappy?
10-04-2017, 12:48 PM
#36
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2010
Posts: 59
Originally Posted by ArrJay
Could you elaborate mainlanders frustrations with living in Hawaii? Is it mostly cost of living issues, schools, and everything stated before or is there scheduling/job expectations that aren't being met? Assuming one moves there after first year is over, in your opinion what expectations would help a transitioning mainlander not be so unhappy?
It could be different for everyone. I can only assume that it is mainly the money issue. Any house in town (honolulu) side is over a million and we are not even talking about a brand new one but probably one built 20-40 years ago. Even places on the west or central of oahu cost somewhere between 700-900k and they are not 2500-3000 sqft houses but 14-1500 sqft house you can barely fit your wife and couple kids while having you neighbor right. next. to. you. about 6ft away from your window..
A good private school’s tuition from what i hear is about 20k per kid.. I myself is a public school product and I really do hope that i’ll be able to send kids thru HI’s public system for their sake but if you just drive around public schools here on this island you are already disappointed about the condition of school buildings and surroundings. No air conditioning for most schools is another thing.
Just those two things mentioned above.. if you do simple math, assuming it is a single family with two children old enough to attend a school: You are looking at somewhere between 5000-8000 bucks a month for your mortgage and two kids attending private schools. And if you are paying that much a month as a fixed cost you can see that even when you are making 150-200k a year, you are still going to be very cautious about your monthly spending.
For me, i have had considerable time in the midwest so of course - being naive and dumb - when I moved into HI after working at a foreign gig i was expecting similar but maybe “little more” expensive and different. But my wife and I quickly realized that it’s still gonna be tough after the first year especially being on a 717 side. Good thing is that my wife and I both lived in one of the most expensive asian cities and the financial situation we are in now is very similar to what we’ve faced back in Asia. At the end, our kids are much happier than back in the days when we were living in a big polluted city and finally we’ve decided that despite all challenges we now have it is still worth a try.
Think about why you wanna come to work for Hawaiian. Is it all the money you could make working for a legacy carrier or is it because you are just so fed up with your current job or some other reason like mine? Depending on what your reason is you may be able to swallow the bitter part and try enjoying your life like I am. Sorry i couldn’t give you a straight answer. Good luck.
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10-06-2017, 03:23 PM
#37
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Narrow/Left Wide/Right
Posts: 3,655
Originally Posted by ArrJay
Could you elaborate mainlanders frustrations with living in Hawaii? Is it mostly cost of living issues, schools, and everything stated before or is there scheduling/job expectations that aren't being met? Assuming one moves there after first year is over, in your opinion what expectations would help a transitioning mainlander not be so unhappy?
BUT: 87% of Hawaii's state senators/reps sent their kids to private school.
How do you think that works out?
10-06-2017, 03:27 PM
#38
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Narrow/Left Wide/Right
Posts: 3,655
Originally Posted by ArrJay
Could you elaborate mainlanders frustrations with living in Hawaii? Is it mostly cost of living issues, schools, and everything stated before or is there scheduling/job expectations that aren't being met? Assuming one moves there after first year is over, in your opinion what expectations would help a transitioning mainlander not be so unhappy?
No one seemed to have much of a problem with it though, the general attitude is "if you loved your kids or they had aptitude, they'd be in private school already".
10-06-2017, 05:55 PM
#39
Line Holder
Joined APC: May 2010
Posts: 85
It’s not just schools, or the $1 million dollar price tag for a 40-80 year old single wall construction pier and post termite eaten house.
Things are different in HI than anywhere else on the mainland. Some people can adjust and some can’t. Plenty of stores and restaurants do not have locations in HI. Many places will not ship things to HI. Many times for inexpensive items, if you can find a company to send it to HI the shipping will be more expensive than the item. Have you seen the traffic? Have you ever lived in a state that does major road construction during the middle of the day?
Anyway, that’s a few off the top of my head but there are many frustrating things in HI that could be and are done more efficiently on the mainland.
All that being said it’s a beautiful state with wonderful people, but it’s really not like any other state for a variety of reasons. Some adjust and love it, some hate it and leave after a few years.
Things are different in HI than anywhere else on the mainland. Some people can adjust and some can’t. Plenty of stores and restaurants do not have locations in HI. Many places will not ship things to HI. Many times for inexpensive items, if you can find a company to send it to HI the shipping will be more expensive than the item. Have you seen the traffic? Have you ever lived in a state that does major road construction during the middle of the day?
Anyway, that’s a few off the top of my head but there are many frustrating things in HI that could be and are done more efficiently on the mainland.
All that being said it’s a beautiful state with wonderful people, but it’s really not like any other state for a variety of reasons. Some adjust and love it, some hate it and leave after a few years.
Originally Posted by full of luv
When I lived there, because of a tiff with the teachers union over budget cuts, they CANCELLED EVERY Friday of public schools, all over the state, for the WHOLE YEAR.
No one seemed to have much of a problem with it though, the general attitude is "if you loved your kids or they had aptitude, they'd be in private school already".
No one seemed to have much of a problem with it though, the general attitude is "if you loved your kids or they had aptitude, they'd be in private school already".
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