Hawaiian Hiring FOs
02-19-2025 | 09:40 AM
#861
On Reserve
Joined: Jan 2024
Posts: 182
Likes: 26
It's a little more complex than that. Your freeze date is actually based on the effective date of the vacancy you get your seat from, so right now new hires are locked into their seats until July 2027, meaning by the time their freeze is up, a bid comes out, they're awarded a new seat, and they finally train in it, there is a good chance they spend closer to 3 years locked in.
It's a big bone of contention that for a lot of 717 FOs that after being on property for over two years, they can be earning $30 an hour less than someone hired a year after them, but their lock still isn't expired. Nobody properly explains how our "training freeze" actually works to new hires, they just tell them 2 year freeze, which is not correct.
It's a big bone of contention that for a lot of 717 FOs that after being on property for over two years, they can be earning $30 an hour less than someone hired a year after them, but their lock still isn't expired. Nobody properly explains how our "training freeze" actually works to new hires, they just tell them 2 year freeze, which is not correct.
02-19-2025 | 10:27 AM
#862
Line Holder
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 871
Likes: 17
From: outside
It's a little more complex than that. Your freeze date is actually based on the effective date of the vacancy you get your seat from, so right now new hires are locked into their seats until July 2027, meaning by the time their freeze is up, a bid comes out, they're awarded a new seat, and they finally train in it, there is a good chance they spend closer to 3 years locked in.
It's a big bone of contention that for a lot of 717 FOs that after being on property for over two years, they can be earning $30 an hour less than someone hired a year after them, but their lock still isn't expired. Nobody properly explains how our "training freeze" actually works to new hires, they just tell them 2 year freeze, which is not correct.
It's a big bone of contention that for a lot of 717 FOs that after being on property for over two years, they can be earning $30 an hour less than someone hired a year after them, but their lock still isn't expired. Nobody properly explains how our "training freeze" actually works to new hires, they just tell them 2 year freeze, which is not correct.
We can get in to First day of activation in that category or effective date, or also new hire date for new equipment. Whatever you want.
your concern or contention issue is based on seniority and what equipment you are awarded. Guess what, it's the same in any airline with different pay scales, unlike if you're from Skywest of Spirit.
It is Not a seat lock, you can upgrade in the same equipment if your seniority can hold the left seat in that aircraft. Yes as you may know, 2022, there were about 20 FOs that upgrade in the 717 within their two year training freeze and did not incur more freeze.
Now, no, that may not ever happen again.
At the movement and until April 2026, a new hire that meets their 24 months from new hire date can bid for the 787, leaving that equipment before your freeze end date. This will allow you or anyone trying to move off their lower paying equipment, ie A321, B717 (FO) to 787 FO. Yes you will train for 6-7 weeks, but for 90 hours a month. To answer your concern/question, you'll incur a new training freeze in the 787, in this example once you are assigned your first day of either Reserve or a flight, your training freeze begins. The 24 months after that you are free to bid something, unless your effective occurs first.
That's the basics. Good luck.
Last edited by Neosporin; 02-19-2025 at 10:30 AM. Reason: Sp
02-19-2025 | 10:48 AM
#863
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2022
Posts: 1,732
Likes: 104
It's a little more complex than that. Your freeze date is actually based on the effective date of the vacancy you get your seat from, so right now new hires are locked into their seats until July 2027, meaning by the time their freeze is up, a bid comes out, they're awarded a new seat, and they finally train in it, there is a good chance they spend closer to 3 years locked in.
It's a big bone of contention that for a lot of 717 FOs that after being on property for over two years, they can be earning $30 an hour less than someone hired a year after them, but their lock still isn't expired. Nobody properly explains how our "training freeze" actually works to new hires, they just tell them 2 year freeze, which is not correct.
It's a big bone of contention that for a lot of 717 FOs that after being on property for over two years, they can be earning $30 an hour less than someone hired a year after them, but their lock still isn't expired. Nobody properly explains how our "training freeze" actually works to new hires, they just tell them 2 year freeze, which is not correct.
sorry, that’s not directed at you but those who have that bone.
02-20-2025 | 08:02 AM
#864
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 44,841
Likes: 653
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
It's a little more complex than that. Your freeze date is actually based on the effective date of the vacancy you get your seat from, so right now new hires are locked into their seats until July 2027, meaning by the time their freeze is up, a bid comes out, they're awarded a new seat, and they finally train in it, there is a good chance they spend closer to 3 years locked in.
It's a big bone of contention that for a lot of 717 FOs that after being on property for over two years, they can be earning $30 an hour less than someone hired a year after them, but their lock still isn't expired. Nobody properly explains how our "training freeze" actually works to new hires, they just tell them 2 year freeze, which is not correct.
It's a big bone of contention that for a lot of 717 FOs that after being on property for over two years, they can be earning $30 an hour less than someone hired a year after them, but their lock still isn't expired. Nobody properly explains how our "training freeze" actually works to new hires, they just tell them 2 year freeze, which is not correct.
02-20-2025 | 03:23 PM
#865
Line Holder
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 433
Likes: 31
02-20-2025 | 04:25 PM
#866
Line Holder
Joined: Apr 2022
Posts: 1,732
Likes: 104
02-21-2025 | 07:34 AM
#867
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 44,841
Likes: 653
From: Engines Turn or People Swim
So I would expect some sort of seat lock, but probably something that is not effectively three years. In the short term, that would actually be a recruiting challenge for a company that has an incentive to hire pilots from specific niche locations.
02-21-2025 | 10:10 AM
#868
Line Holder
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 433
Likes: 31
We actually have no seat lock for new hires, and it was a big PITA for the company while the bus was around. But you have to recall that AS has been a multi-fleet airline in the past, I know guys who flew MD's and 727's. Not sure why they didn't have the lock at all.
So I would expect some sort of seat lock, but probably something that is not effectively three years. In the short term, that would actually be a recruiting challenge for a company that has an incentive to hire pilots from specific niche locations.
So I would expect some sort of seat lock, but probably something that is not effectively three years. In the short term, that would actually be a recruiting challenge for a company that has an incentive to hire pilots from specific niche locations.
02-21-2025 | 05:04 PM
#869
Line Holder
Joined: Nov 2015
Posts: 384
Likes: 1
at Hawaiian they started doing all freight indoc classes so that the guys that wanted 330 frieght would know they were getting it before showing up to class. One day is indoc for freight and the next day would be indoc for the other fleets. They would then join both classes together for the remainder of indoc. It was the fix cuz several new hires quit day one once they weren’t awarded 330 freight.
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