Originally Posted by galaxy flyer

In today’s world, every employee is a walking P&L statement, do you produce a profit or a loss in how you do your job. Volunteer work, could be interpreted by the hiring people, as an indicator of willingness to engage with customers, go an extra mile to satisfy them. Just a four-year degree shows perseverance and effort. I’d bet their internal studies prove the case. They don’t make these standards up out of thin air.

Originally Posted by Learflyer

No. Flying corporate, frac, or charter for years demonstrates this! That's why SWA (and others) has figured out that a pretty darn good pool of candidates come from these ranks.

Originally Posted by Flyboy68

Here's a scenario. HR is interviewing 2 pilots, both have the same flight times and types. Both are very nice people who have great recommendations and reputations with their coworkers.

Pilot A is single, lived most of their time in base, and has extracurricular activities that would rival Mother Teresa.

Pilot B is married and has 2 kids, and commutes to work because they don't want to pull their kids out of a school they love and excel at, and has immediate family on both sides where they live. Pilot B is a great parent and spouse. They spend every moment they are home with their children, spouse, and family.

Which one of these pilots is a "better person"? According to HR, it's obviously pilot A, which is bull$hit.

"Being a good citizen" is incredibly subjective, and basing your opinion on what someone does in their spare time is ridiculous. I think that that being a great parent and spouse is "being a good citizen".

Well, I'm going to live my life as I see fit to. On the few days I'm at home, I'm going to spend my time fixing things around the house, doing yardwork, and spending time with my wife. Occasionally I may be able to join her at our RV at the beach and do some fishing (which she loves to do) and let the chips fall where they may.

I'm not going to be on my deathbed thinking, "I should have spent more time doing volunteer work instead of with my wife and family".

Originally Posted by Flyboy68

This is a stupid statement. We're pilots, not social workers. What the hell does community service have to do with flying airplanes? It's attitudes like yours that condone this BS and allow it to flourish and get worse. What's the next requirement unrelated to flying that HR departments will think up?

Do you have data that shows that pilots that do community service are better pilots or employees? Until you can show me the data, I'll continue to believe it's an absolute bull$hit requirement made up by HR idiots.

Originally Posted by galaxy flyer

In today’s world, every employee is a walking P&L statement, do you produce a profit or a loss in how you do your job. Volunteer work, could be interpreted by the hiring people, as an indicator of willingness to engage with customers, go an extra mile to satisfy them. Just a four-year degree shows perseverance and effort. I’d bet their internal studies prove the case. They don’t make these standards up out of thin air.

Originally Posted by rickair7777

Most of us tend to think that, but it's not up to us.

If it makes you feel any better I held out for a very specific set of circumstances (geography) and didn't jump through hoops, attend job fairs, etc. The only volunteer work I did was stuff I was going to do anyway with my kids. It took me longer to get where I was going, but that was OK as my financial situation was never solely dependent on airlines. I'm a people person, so I did have an extensive network and plenty of LOR's.

Originally Posted by rickair7777

Your light bulb may have come on there...

Like other industries and businesses they are going to prefer to hire someone who lives near the work location and doesn't have a family! Family men (and women even more so) are going to have outside distractions (typically pesky things called kids) which will increase absenteeism and distract time and emotional energy from what should be your REAL priority in life: Work.

Also screening for folks who have plenty of time for frivolous discretionary activities will help weed out older employees. They can't age discriminate directly, but they can try to filter for attributes which correlate to their desired age range. Not legal if done for that reason but very hard to prove.

So you have to play their game, you can get around their age filters with some effort, and if you do that to a sufficient degree they have to honor it, despite your age.

Originally Posted by Flyboy68

This is a stupid statement. We're pilots, not social workers. What the hell does community service have to do with flying airplanes? It's attitudes like yours that condone this BS and allow it to flourish and get worse. What's the next requirement unrelated to flying that HR departments will think up?

Do you have data that shows that pilots that do community service are better pilots or employees? Until you can show me the data, I'll continue to believe it's an absolute bull$hit requirement made up by HR idiots.