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What's happening at Horizon and Jets?

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What's happening at Horizon and Jets?

Old 10-24-2015, 04:24 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by Klsytakesit View Post
In 2013 we voted yes to a concessionary contract that runs for 5 years and we did vote to shrink down to transcons/ hawaii and a speck of central america.....

These 30 E175's may very well be the start of that happening. It seems there is a group of Alaska pilots concerned about this, but the majority seems to be too busy looking up at that big 2 in front of 10 year Captain pay to be thinking about whether or not their jobs are being outsourced.

That being said, what is the Alaska mainline/regional ratio and how does that compare to DAL, UAL, and AA? Seems like a lot more Alaska flying is done by mainline but that there is more growth on the "regional" level.


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Old 10-24-2015, 05:24 PM
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Default What's happening at Horizon and Jets?

Originally Posted by Mercyful Fate View Post
Mainline jobs at Alaska are more at risk due to Delta's push on Seattle than stinking regional jets....

I don't think the two are unrelated. Alaska doesn't have the scope limitations of Delta so it could be a good financial move for them to outsource as much "regional" flying as possible, and given that Alaska's average stage length is around 800 miles, that could be A LOT of flying.

On top of that, if Delta does crush Alaska in Seattle, the most likely outcome would be some kind of merger which isn't the worst thing that could happen to Alaska mainline pilots. Slowly removing older, shorter range 737's and not hiring to fill attrition is a lot worse. Not saying that's happening here, but without scope, it could happen.


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Old 10-24-2015, 05:25 PM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by Mercyful Fate View Post
Mainline jobs at Alaska are more at risk due to Delta's push on Seattle than stinking regional jets....
Likely you could be on to something there....of course the wide, standup 2-cabin class E-175 with a normal lavs and a galley that comes and goes from a regular height jetway is not anything near a "regional" jet
 
Old 10-24-2015, 06:10 PM
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But think of The E175, as freeing up a 737 that was doing a GEG turn to fly a route that can better compete with Delta.. Smart move. Faster acsess to expand central america...
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Old 10-24-2015, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Mercyful Fate View Post
Mainline jobs at Alaska are more at risk due to Delta's push on Seattle than stinking regional jets....
Delta doesn't give a **** about Alaska competition, DAL could bankrupt Alaska quickly if they wanted to. Simple, walk into a every Horizon crew room and offer the pilots a class date. They could take 30-40 a month if they wanted to. Good luck Brad finding pilots to do 40% of your domestic flying. Those pesky overpaid Horizon pilots...
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Old 10-24-2015, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by amcnd View Post
But think of The E175, as freeing up a 737 that was doing a GEG turn to fly a route that can better compete with Delta.. Smart move. Faster acsess to expand central america...

I would agree with you, but it isn't flying to GEG. It's flying to f---ing Texas. Hence, it is not a "regional" jet, it is a mainline class airplane that is just barely below the arbitrary cutoff of what defines a regional jet. It is a smart move from the shareholders perspective, replace mainline flying with "regional" flying done by cheaper crews. Don't believe the management emails about how this is only about competition with Delta. AAG isn't just "freeing up 737's," they are making a concerted effort to reduce labor costs through outsourcing.


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Old 10-24-2015, 08:19 PM
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Regarding the E-Jets, it's only a "regional" airplane if the region is "North America."
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Old 10-24-2015, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by pete2800 View Post
Regarding the E-Jets, it's only a "regional" airplane if the region is "North America."

Hawaii is part of the USA...how long until that is "regional" too? Seems "regional" means 76-seats or less. And here I thought seats were a measure of capacity, but I guess it's a unit of distance...


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Old 10-25-2015, 08:47 AM
  #29  
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Originally Posted by Phteven View Post

That being said, what is the Alaska mainline/regional ratio and how does that compare to DAL, UAL, and AA? Seems like a lot more Alaska flying is done by mainline but that there is more growth on the "regional" level.


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From the 2014 10Ks
American Airlines | Investor Relations | SEC Filings
DAL 12.31.2014 10K
United - Investor Relations - SEC Filings
http://www.annualreports.com/Click/1020

Fleet Count at the end of 2014
DAL mainline 772 regional 499
AAL mainline 983 regional 566
UAL mainline 691 regional 566
ALK mainline 137 regional 59


Regional ASMs as a percentage of Consolidated ASMs

DAL 10.49%
AAL 10.59%
UAL 12.97%
ALK 10.11%
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Old 10-25-2015, 09:42 AM
  #30  
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Has AAG announced how they plan on filling the gap between the Q400 and the 738? I don't recall them saying anything about it. I'd be worried more about that. 28% savings is a huge chunk of change for QX, even with how cheap we are. I'm going to go tin hat here, but here's what I think the board at AAG is hoping for(obviously just a thought):
Get QX to cut 28%
Order an array of aircraft to cover the gap (Embraer 175s and 190s)
Place them at a regional to fly (notice how I didn't say just QX?)
Take a portion of the 28% savings and give the Alaska pilots some as a bribe to go along with this.
Every few years revisit the whipsaw to order more large regional jets to replace Alaska mainline flying.

All this is obviously hypothetical based on both pilot groups going along with this which is more far fetched than my above theory.

Fire away.
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