Scope above all? Why exposed for so long?
07-05-2018 | 09:47 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 3,150
Likes: 0
From: Left,Right, Left, Right,Right,Left, Right, Left
BS. They don't KNOW what the company truly intends to do. They fought to get the best scope language the company WOULD AGREE TO.
Now, it's up to you, me and the rest of us to understand why the company gave what it gave and built a fortress around certain things.
I'm glad we have RJ language, very glad. Time will tell why they were willing to give that up, but not domestic codeshare.
Now, it's up to you, me and the rest of us to understand why the company gave what it gave and built a fortress around certain things.
I'm glad we have RJ language, very glad. Time will tell why they were willing to give that up, but not domestic codeshare.
You guys are so worried about domestic code share? why not just farm it all out to delta united and swa? Why don't we just sell all our west coast seats on alaska? oh no moxy is trying to get some shiny new jets oh no!
why not? because there's no money in it. that's why. If jb wants to keep the ATM firing out fun tickets, it needs it's own planes on it's own routes.
07-05-2018 | 10:33 AM
#22
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 6,935
Likes: 0
From: Airbus Capt
come on man. the whole thing is not a conspiracy. you asked what they gave up for us to get that scope, those are the guys that would have the answer.
You guys are so worried about domestic code share? why not just farm it all out to delta united and swa? Why don't we just sell all our west coast seats on alaska? oh no moxy is trying to get some shiny new jets oh no!
why not? because there's no money in it. that's why. If jb wants to keep the ATM firing out fun tickets, it needs it's own planes on it's own routes.
You guys are so worried about domestic code share? why not just farm it all out to delta united and swa? Why don't we just sell all our west coast seats on alaska? oh no moxy is trying to get some shiny new jets oh no!
why not? because there's no money in it. that's why. If jb wants to keep the ATM firing out fun tickets, it needs it's own planes on it's own routes.
2. We won't farm out our existing flying, but we may very well use Alaska's West coast network to connect and feed our east coast network, since they actually HAVE a west coast network and we can longer CREDIBLY build one because there are no more gates at the premium airports.
I've heard we may have a deal for more gates at SFO, but until that is announced, it's just fantasy.
Moxy, no one knows where they will operate, but it may be part of JBs future.
I love the RJ fear mongers who say JB was gonna farm out it's flying to RJs because "they weren't going to, until they did" and then say why would we domestic codeshare, "we've never done that all these years, if domestic codeshare was a problem they would have done it by now"....
07-05-2018 | 11:14 AM
#23
Line Holder
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,567
Likes: 84
1. I didn't ask what we gave up to get it, you must have misunderstood.
2. We won't farm out our existing flying, but we may very well use Alaska's West coast network to connect and feed our east coast network, since they actually HAVE a west coast network and we can longer CREDIBLY build one because there are no more gates at the premium airports.
I've heard we may have a deal for more gates at SFO, but until that is announced, it's just fantasy.
Moxy, no one knows where they will operate, but it may be part of JBs future.
I love the RJ fear mongers who say JB was gonna farm out it's flying to RJs because "they weren't going to, until they did" and then say why would we domestic codeshare, "we've never done that all these years, if domestic codeshare was a problem they would have done it by now"....
2. We won't farm out our existing flying, but we may very well use Alaska's West coast network to connect and feed our east coast network, since they actually HAVE a west coast network and we can longer CREDIBLY build one because there are no more gates at the premium airports.
I've heard we may have a deal for more gates at SFO, but until that is announced, it's just fantasy.
Moxy, no one knows where they will operate, but it may be part of JBs future.
I love the RJ fear mongers who say JB was gonna farm out it's flying to RJs because "they weren't going to, until they did" and then say why would we domestic codeshare, "we've never done that all these years, if domestic codeshare was a problem they would have done it by now"....
The management of this airline had multiple carriers flying our passengers overnight in 2007 after the “Valentines day massacre”. While circumstances today are different Jetblue mentality is all about paying others to do what you CAN do yourself. Spending capital to prevent this does sting but the necessity of it all CANNOT be overstated.
07-05-2018 | 11:20 AM
#24
Line Holder
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,567
Likes: 84
This is what the newer pilots here fail to understand. Neeleman told us we would not go west. Barger said we would never go Deep South. The 190’s were purchased to open smaller domestic markets. I could go on and on with what we were told as to where we are today. I’m not complaining about the business model changing, the simple fact is the model does change and if we have the opportunity to affect how it evolves then we must.
07-05-2018 | 11:28 AM
#25
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 6,935
Likes: 0
From: Airbus Capt
*NO* one is disputing that having RJ scope is a good thing. We all want that. Done.
Now, why did the company give that up (they never give up anything they hold sacred) but choose to build a fortress around domestic codeshare?
If this company had ANY intentions of doing capacity purchase agreements, they wouldn't have agreed to our new scope. Now, things could change, and I'm glad we have that scope, but IF they had any intentions of RJs, they wouldn't have given that up. But they DID build a fortress around domestic codesharing. Why?
Now, why did the company give that up (they never give up anything they hold sacred) but choose to build a fortress around domestic codeshare?
If this company had ANY intentions of doing capacity purchase agreements, they wouldn't have agreed to our new scope. Now, things could change, and I'm glad we have that scope, but IF they had any intentions of RJs, they wouldn't have given that up. But they DID build a fortress around domestic codesharing. Why?
07-05-2018 | 11:35 AM
#26
Line Holder
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,567
Likes: 84
*NO* one is disputing that having RJ scope is a good thing. We all want that. Done.
Now, why did the company give that up (they never give up anything they hold sacred) but choose to build a fortress around domestic codeshare?
If this company had ANY intentions of doing capacity purchase agreements, they wouldn't have agreed to our new scope. Now, things could change, and I'm glad we have that scope, but IF they had any intentions of RJs, they wouldn't have given that up. But they DID build a fortress around domestic codesharing. Why?
Now, why did the company give that up (they never give up anything they hold sacred) but choose to build a fortress around domestic codeshare?
If this company had ANY intentions of doing capacity purchase agreements, they wouldn't have agreed to our new scope. Now, things could change, and I'm glad we have that scope, but IF they had any intentions of RJs, they wouldn't have given that up. But they DID build a fortress around domestic codesharing. Why?
07-05-2018 | 01:01 PM
#27
Banned
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,132
Likes: 0
"Would agree to" with virtually no resistance from us. Air conditioned office meetings and one silent campout are hardly a show of force. If more of these events occur, then BJ would be more compelled to agree to more favorable terms.
This communique is for entertainment purposes only. It does not implicitly or explicitly acknowledge employment with any air carrier nor is any relationship implied. This communique does not represent the opinions or policies of ALPA or JB ALPA and does not represent the collective pilot group, ALPA, nor does it imply collective bargaining, advocacy, or workforce actions intended to disrupt operations.
07-05-2018 | 01:20 PM
#28
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 6,935
Likes: 0
From: Airbus Capt
It’s unlikely we will ever know and I am ok with that. To your point why did they give us so much control over pairing construction and work rules? Perhaps they are shortsited and simply trying to limit pay and benefits. Given the fervor with which Jetblue has used “open architecture” to code share this is still a victory in my book.
I sure hope not.
07-05-2018 | 01:23 PM
#29
Line Holder
Joined: May 2012
Posts: 1,567
Likes: 84
You may well be right. The airline, while seemingly rudderless, if often a few steps a head in a lot of ways. I still think they have other ventures they are more interested in and this was not that important. Either way Jetblue was able to monetize the “want” from the union.
07-05-2018 | 01:52 PM
#30
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 6,935
Likes: 0
From: Airbus Capt
You may well be right. The airline, while seemingly rudderless, if often a few steps a head in a lot of ways. I still think they have other ventures they are more interested in and this was not that important. Either way Jetblue was able to monetize the “want” from the union.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
