TA voting is open
01-25-2023, 12:27 PM
#51
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 983
Originally Posted by pilotpayne
Man can I go get the quote of you giving me a hard time about you asking some questions?
oh yeah here it is “Roy”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy Biggins
The risk is we send this back and get nothing in return. The company just pulls the offer, keeps filling classes with wet ATP’s and decides they can roll with what they’ve got until JCBA. That is an absolute valid risk in this scenario. Then what Joe? What if they decide to file for mediation? Also a possibility. Yea, for me it’s a substantial raise, and it makes more sense to take the money now….start negotiating again in 12 months (possibly even sooner). I’m not sure where the disconnect is here Joe? How am I contradicting myself? If we send it back, no I don’t think it comes back with PS….if at all. I don’t know why they agreed to this TA because it wasn’t designed to attract pilots (the company could have raised 1st year pay substantial but they didn’t). Kudos to the union for at least getting this done. They’re still putting peeps in classes. I’m done talking about this. It’s pointless. Vote your conscious. I’ll die on my bill during the JCBA.
oh yeah here it is “Roy”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy Biggins
The risk is we send this back and get nothing in return. The company just pulls the offer, keeps filling classes with wet ATP’s and decides they can roll with what they’ve got until JCBA. That is an absolute valid risk in this scenario. Then what Joe? What if they decide to file for mediation? Also a possibility. Yea, for me it’s a substantial raise, and it makes more sense to take the money now….start negotiating again in 12 months (possibly even sooner). I’m not sure where the disconnect is here Joe? How am I contradicting myself? If we send it back, no I don’t think it comes back with PS….if at all. I don’t know why they agreed to this TA because it wasn’t designed to attract pilots (the company could have raised 1st year pay substantial but they didn’t). Kudos to the union for at least getting this done. They’re still putting peeps in classes. I’m done talking about this. It’s pointless. Vote your conscious. I’ll die on my bill during the JCBA.
01-25-2023, 12:52 PM
#52
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: blueJet
Posts: 4,511
The ALPA said profit sharing was a must-have or there’d be a labor dispute.
Then the company said NO to profit sharing.
Then the NC said we’ll take it to the MEC.
Then the MEC/LEC voted 100% in favor of the AIP.
Now the pilots are going to vote in a deal with NO profit sharing.
In addition, Spirit pilots just voted 75-25 in favor of a deal with NO profit sharing.
You would have to be on crack to think this trend points to us getting profit sharing in the JCBA.
Then the company said NO to profit sharing.
Then the NC said we’ll take it to the MEC.
Then the MEC/LEC voted 100% in favor of the AIP.
Now the pilots are going to vote in a deal with NO profit sharing.
In addition, Spirit pilots just voted 75-25 in favor of a deal with NO profit sharing.
You would have to be on crack to think this trend points to us getting profit sharing in the JCBA.
01-25-2023, 12:58 PM
#53
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2015
Posts: 418
Originally Posted by Boomer
The ALPA said profit sharing was a must-have or there’d be a labor dispute.
Then the company said NO to profit sharing.
Then the NC said we’ll take it to the MEC.
Then the MEC/LEC voted 100% in favor of the AIP.
Now the pilots are going to vote in a deal with NO profit sharing.
In addition, Spirit pilots just voted 75-25 in favor of a deal with NO profit sharing.
You would have to be on crack to think this trend points to us getting profit sharing in the JCBA.
Then the company said NO to profit sharing.
Then the NC said we’ll take it to the MEC.
Then the MEC/LEC voted 100% in favor of the AIP.
Now the pilots are going to vote in a deal with NO profit sharing.
In addition, Spirit pilots just voted 75-25 in favor of a deal with NO profit sharing.
You would have to be on crack to think this trend points to us getting profit sharing in the JCBA.
01-25-2023, 01:33 PM
#54
Bluediver the REAL deal
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 327
Originally Posted by Bluedriver
Even if this passes, it does not mean we got all we could have. We went down the field, got a 1st down on the company's 9 yardline, and then just kicked a field goal to lose by 3 points with plenty of time left on the clock.
01-25-2023, 01:41 PM
#55
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 918
This is for seekingblue and that negotiating committe guy that keeps reverberating the sentence of United and AA is a "mess" right now.
No, they managed to say NO to the company and do the huge task of restructuring their union leaders/negotiators (yeah call that a mess if you want) because they know what they are worth, and the TA that was presented wasn't it. They are not here counting how much money they are losing each month under the unworthy TA. They are focused on moving their group, and the industry as a whole, FORWARD. While we sit here calling them a mess and putting sheit all over our own faces. No worries though, pattern bargaining and snap up (which is pretty much nothing until MAYBE 2024) will keep us fighting for last place among our peer set (UAL, DAL, AA, SWA and I guess ALK since our MEC includes them in the snap up after saying in LOA 17 that they weren't. Cool story. whatever.)
No, they managed to say NO to the company and do the huge task of restructuring their union leaders/negotiators (yeah call that a mess if you want) because they know what they are worth, and the TA that was presented wasn't it. They are not here counting how much money they are losing each month under the unworthy TA. They are focused on moving their group, and the industry as a whole, FORWARD. While we sit here calling them a mess and putting sheit all over our own faces. No worries though, pattern bargaining and snap up (which is pretty much nothing until MAYBE 2024) will keep us fighting for last place among our peer set (UAL, DAL, AA, SWA and I guess ALK since our MEC includes them in the snap up after saying in LOA 17 that they weren't. Cool story. whatever.)
01-25-2023, 01:55 PM
#56
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2012
Position: 190 captain and “Pro-pilot”
Posts: 2,918
Originally Posted by Roy Biggins
Is there a question somewhere in here Joe?
No there wouldn’t be would there? I said the one of you responding to my question. Hence the quote. But here you go.
Originally Posted by pilotpayne
What exactly is the “risk”.
You just said we could get PS in the JCBA but you don’t think we will and in the other post you say the company can fill classes with wet ATPS no problem. Again so why in the world did our company agree to this? They could have said nah we can wait. Also they defend something to the end that apparently everyone thinks is worthless.
All said in a respectful way. But I think most yes guys are just like give me the money now and maybe I’ll worry about this other stuff later. (That’s certainly a valid view and if I were to bet a majority view here)
Its going to be entertaining in a few years after the merger is done and the company starts making cash (otherwise why merge) we don’t get PS in the JCBA and all the guys are going to be like but but I thought you guys wouldn’t make money can I have some?
You just said we could get PS in the JCBA but you don’t think we will and in the other post you say the company can fill classes with wet ATPS no problem. Again so why in the world did our company agree to this? They could have said nah we can wait. Also they defend something to the end that apparently everyone thinks is worthless.
All said in a respectful way. But I think most yes guys are just like give me the money now and maybe I’ll worry about this other stuff later. (That’s certainly a valid view and if I were to bet a majority view here)
Its going to be entertaining in a few years after the merger is done and the company starts making cash (otherwise why merge) we don’t get PS in the JCBA and all the guys are going to be like but but I thought you guys wouldn’t make money can I have some?
01-25-2023, 01:56 PM
#57
The REAL Bluedriver
Joined APC: Sep 2011
Position: Airbus Capt
Posts: 6,881
Originally Posted by DrSmacFum
My only concern is how do they plan to change JB managements mind about PS when its time for the JCBA? I saw some frustration on 1 of the reps faces when he spoke on JB thinking Profit Sharing would need to be for everyone, not just the pilots.
How do they plan to educate (lol) them that PS could specifically be for the Pilot group? I wish they had some plan to make it an actual discussion, instead of not even negotiating it.
Just rambles from a new guy that wants to be here long term
How do they plan to educate (lol) them that PS could specifically be for the Pilot group? I wish they had some plan to make it an actual discussion, instead of not even negotiating it.
Just rambles from a new guy that wants to be here long term
01-25-2023, 02:01 PM
#58
Bluediver the REAL deal
Joined APC: Jul 2022
Posts: 327
Originally Posted by Bluedriver
A year or two before COVID the company promised to fix EVERYONE'S profit sharing, all non-management employees. Then did nothing.
But, but, but Task Force! It’s simple. I like to say Fix the formula, fix the problem. Its probably the same saying the company used in 2016.
01-25-2023, 03:19 PM
#59
Line holder
Joined APC: Nov 2013
Position: On the bus,seat 0A
Posts: 3,228
Originally Posted by Boomer
The ALPA said profit sharing was a must-have or there’d be a labor dispute.
Then the company said NO to profit sharing.
Then the NC said we’ll take it to the MEC.
Then the MEC/LEC voted 100% in favor of the AIP.
Now the pilots are going to vote in a deal with NO profit sharing.
In addition, Spirit pilots just voted 75-25 in favor of a deal with NO profit sharing.
You would have to be on crack to think this trend points to us getting profit sharing in the JCBA.
Then the company said NO to profit sharing.
Then the NC said we’ll take it to the MEC.
Then the MEC/LEC voted 100% in favor of the AIP.
Now the pilots are going to vote in a deal with NO profit sharing.
In addition, Spirit pilots just voted 75-25 in favor of a deal with NO profit sharing.
You would have to be on crack to think this trend points to us getting profit sharing in the JCBA.
01-25-2023, 03:28 PM
#60
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 983
Originally Posted by pilotpayne
No there wouldn’t be would there? I said the one of you responding to my question. Hence the quote. But here you go.
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