Is a grievance process what I want? Yes, you are exactly right. Having some power over the company is a good thing, not a bad thing. I don't want to have a career with this company if they can abuse me with work rules.

As far as getting a union right now? Yeah, we need a union now so that 3 or 4 years from now we can have a cba. Of course getting this started will take time, but saying right now doesn't mean right now. Voting now is voting for the future.

 

Auburn,

You also said, "the management here will need to act swiftly, or they will find themselves back in the same position we are in today."

What if they dont act swiftly? Your statement says it all doesn't it? "They will find themselves," how about changing that statement to "we will find ourselves back in the same position." If management doesn't act swiftly then what is our recourse now? We can't grieve crap with these people. They are free to run the table on us and here we sit like a bunch of numbskulls hoping they will fix it. Let's face it we are the fools, I am the fool, you are the fool, its not them that is the problem, we are. We have let this situation go on for years, well no more for me. Management loves the current relationship, the do what they want don't they?

 

Just to keep the truth out in the open, the JBPA offered the company to sign a letter by which they agreed to let the company go ahead with their sham committees and implement all those magical changes that were coming but now are not possible due to the filing .the company refused.
you keep telling lies,I'll keep telling the truth. go ahead hero, I have lots of time off.
you still haven't answered how we can set up a non-qualified retirement plan for pilots without a cba, or how we can remain on the self insured group plan with a different SPD without a cba......come on, wikipedia not working for you Dan?maybe the BOB can help you? or maybe they don't know the answer either.....or they know the answer but don't like it...care to guess? you can't without a cba.

those 2 reasons alone are worth thousand upon thousands of dollars, a lot more that you will ever pay in dues, and are of zero cost to the company or the pilots but cannot be obtained without a cba.

 

I've got no dog in this hunt. I've got a few friends there and they're all over the spectrum on this subject. My question; when is the voting closed and when will the results be announced? Good luck to all of you, both personally and professionally, regardless of the outcome.
fbh

 

I don't have a dog in this fight either, however, I will say this. At my company scheduling blatently violates contract too. I do the same as you, talked to the supervisor, if that goes no where I have talked to the cp. The issue too is resolved in a day or too. Just because you have union doesn't mean you speak to Cp's or managers, unless you work for AA right now. I generally have a good relationship with my cp. The only difference with a union I have a little more leverage(not TV show either). I can unleash 800lb gorilla on them if they misbehave.

 

removed for lack of interest

 

Every guy I fly with is against the union. Tell me what the Unions did for Delta and their pensions? What did they do for United? NOTHING! I can't see giving my hard earned money to a group of "leaders" that we know nothing about and not even sure they can lead! Do you want to lose 5% of your pay to those guys? A delta guy was on one of our flights and he was cussing his Union. They charge him 5% and now that their machine boys union want to fight they want to take more money from him to boost the funds to one million dollars and then take money from their checks anytime the fund drops below that during a fight. How do you like losing what you have like letting your kids jumpseat? With a union all bets are off and EVERYTHING is negotiable! You who want a union now have no clue what you have and will lose. What will you gain that you can't do without a union? Think about it before you vote. Most guys that wanted information had no clue they were asking for a union vote just by asking. What information did you get? Who is the leadership? What is their goals? What are they doing for you that will help this company? The biggest complainers I have ever run into are union guys. If this company is so bad why not just go to another Company? There are lots of other Unions that would love to have you!

 

With a union, you negotiate, without one, you beg. There's a lot of dissatisfaction with unions out there, but just about everyone who has a union knows they're much better off than being non-union. ALPA dues, which I believe are the highest in the industry are 1.95% and well worth it. The only reason non-union employees in heavily unionized industries make as much as they do is because of the hard work and sacrifice of the unionized employees at other companies. The sad part is one of two injustices are going to happen out of this: The employees at Jet Blue who deserve a union will not get one or the employees who don't deserve a union will.

 

I'd love to see you prove or cite your source for the 5% dues. I'm guessing you can't! Stop being a lamb that's being led to slaughter. Sounds like you've been duped by mgmt propaganda.....of course, all airline mgmts would have you believe you're going to pay 5% of your wages and you will no longer have an 'open door policy' once you become union. Don't buy it......(edit remainder, 'cause I don't have anything else nice to say).

 

you really need to stop making things up .

Delta is ALPA AND THEIR DUES IS 2%. DO YOU REALLY WANT TO KNOW WHAT THE UNION DID FOR ual AND DELTA? WELL LETS SEE, DO YOU SEE NARROW BODY'S FLYING BY UNITED PILOTS ON UNITED SENIORITY LIST? WELL, THE COMPANY WOULD HAVE TAKEN THAT FLYING AWAY IF IT WASN'T FOR THE UNION. DO YOU KNOW DELTA PILOTS GOT OVER 800 mill for their pension? do you want to compare LOL,Medical and M & A language of their contract with ours? do you understand what happens when acompnay flies for chapter 11 and you have federally appointed anti -labor judges allowing managmetn to use the system for what it was not intended to?do you not understand the management at both airlines you cited wanted to extract more draconian concessions
and the union prevented that? don't you understand their CBA are still far superior to our pathetic PEA' when you look at TOTAL COMPENSATION?what would have happen on Delta's merger if they didn't have a union?

inform yourself and stop making things up.