Delta Pilots Association
10-31-2010, 06:36 AM
#1991
Runs with scissors
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Going to hell in a bucket, but enjoying the ride .
Posts: 7,722
It's not a raise until -after- full restoration...
Consistent with strategic renegotiation, pilots { whose average wages were
much higher than the PBGC maximum guarantee { made wage concessions of 32.5%. In contrast,
non-pilot employees were mostly covered by the PBGC guarantee and hence agreed only to a much
smaller 10% wage cut.
Remember our 32.5% pay cut vs. their 10% pay cut, the next time some senior mama tells you how much more of a hit she took than you did...
Consistent with strategic renegotiation, pilots { whose average wages were
much higher than the PBGC maximum guarantee { made wage concessions of 32.5%. In contrast,
non-pilot employees were mostly covered by the PBGC guarantee and hence agreed only to a much
smaller 10% wage cut.
Remember our 32.5% pay cut vs. their 10% pay cut, the next time some senior mama tells you how much more of a hit she took than you did...
10-31-2010, 06:42 AM
#1992
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: 757 Left
Posts: 1,306
This thread seems to just complain about ALPA. How about some reasons why DPA will make our lives better? Not pipe dreams.
- Why would cutting ourselves off from our fellow major airline pilots and making ourselves a smaller group improve our political clout on any of these issues?
- Why would we get better contracts? Professional negotiators? We could do that now.
- How can we trust the people who want to run this?
- Why would a smaller group of just Delta guys listen anymore than those in charge now?
So far I just don't see it. I look around at the airlines that are in house, (ex SWA and they've had history below average contracts), and I see a big mess as far as representation goes.
- Why would cutting ourselves off from our fellow major airline pilots and making ourselves a smaller group improve our political clout on any of these issues?
- Why would we get better contracts? Professional negotiators? We could do that now.
- How can we trust the people who want to run this?
- Why would a smaller group of just Delta guys listen anymore than those in charge now?
So far I just don't see it. I look around at the airlines that are in house, (ex SWA and they've had history below average contracts), and I see a big mess as far as representation goes.
Last edited by Hawaii50; 10-31-2010 at 07:57 AM.
10-31-2010, 06:47 AM
#1993
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: What day is it?
Posts: 963
Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
I do know. What they get in return is to be seen as team players. You will not get your follow-on government job if you are not a team player. Babbit, Woerth, etc are examples of ALPA leaders who were inexplicably weak while in office, and now we see that it was not so inexplicable after all. If anyone thinks that the main goal of anybody high up in ALPA national is to look out for their pilots, then return to the seniority list - needs some fresh air.
Carl
Carl
Cut forward. Look at Babbit's post ALPA resume and who he's worked for. And guess who lobbied hard for him to get the job over Woerth? ATA, because he was a known entity and not so "close" to the pilots.
Who lobbied hard against Woerth besides ATA? Here's a hint: They occupy office space at 1625 Massachusetts Avenue, 8th floor. A building they once owned.
10-31-2010, 07:01 AM
#1994
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: What day is it?
Posts: 963
Originally Posted by Carl Spackler
So people can threaten other people on APC and it's not against the TOS? OK then.
It is very important to all the posters and lurkers on this thread to know what kind of a "person" slowplay is. He/she is a person that will go as far as threatening people (via PM) if they don't stop posting an opinon that he/she disagrees with.
Carl
It is very important to all the posters and lurkers on this thread to know what kind of a "person" slowplay is. He/she is a person that will go as far as threatening people (via PM) if they don't stop posting an opinon that he/she disagrees with.
Carl
He also get's pinged every time someone posts anything that relates to ALPA...
[deleted]
...talk about "Big Brother." And he likes to send p/m's addressed not to your blog name, but your personal name...interesting, huh?
And all this is being done while collecting a paycheck and having a retirement funded by your ALPA dues.
Last edited by vagabond; 10-31-2010 at 07:57 AM. Reason: please do not post personal identifiers of any kind
10-31-2010, 07:10 AM
#1995
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2009
Position: What day is it?
Posts: 963
Originally Posted by acl65pilot
Carl;
We the Mods, have gone over this internally many times. PM's are not part of our scope of Moding. As Slow has done, he can post his PM to you, but you cannot post his PM. In effect, the author can post it, but the receiver cannot. Other than that, ppl are really free to do what they want in a PM exchange.
We the Mods, have gone over this internally many times. PM's are not part of our scope of Moding. As Slow has done, he can post his PM to you, but you cannot post his PM. In effect, the author can post it, but the receiver cannot. Other than that, ppl are really free to do what they want in a PM exchange.
I understand this is way off topic for the thread, however it seems that your reply is analagous to saying, "Yes, I saw my neighbor beating his wife. But unless she calls the cops, it's none of my business."
I respect the position you and the other mod's are in. I would say however, that when you have someone who is using the TOS rules in a manner that allows them to issue threats...veiled or otherwise...against others...that the party sending the p/m's should be identified to the recipient by the mods if the recipient requests the information.
Levels the playing field a bit.
10-31-2010, 07:35 AM
#1996
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
ATC; The simple fact is that when one registers there is no name given. That is for a reason. The only thing that is required these days is a e-mail address that is not "free" IE a att.com, comcast, etc. Not a AOL, yahoo, gmail, etc. There is no identifying information given to either the Admins or the Mods. I would LOVE to know who some ppl are, but the fact is that this board is anonymous until said user opts out of it by posting their own name. Even the mods to do not have that info. I mean that.
If you feel that something is going on, report the PM. There is now that function with the new V Board update and the mods will all get to look at it and come to a consensus on what to do. The report icon is on the top right side of each PM.
Hope this helps.
If you feel that something is going on, report the PM. There is now that function with the new V Board update and the mods will all get to look at it and come to a consensus on what to do. The report icon is on the top right side of each PM.
Hope this helps.
10-31-2010, 08:38 AM
#1999
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,539
Originally Posted by ATCsaidDoWhat
Carl:
He also get's pinged every time someone posts anything that relates to ALPA...
[deleted].
He also get's pinged every time someone posts anything that relates to ALPA...
[deleted].
Originally Posted by ATCsaidDoWhat
...talk about "Big Brother." And he likes to send p/m's addressed not to your blog name, but your personal name...interesting, huh?
Originally Posted by ATCsaidDoWhat
And all this is being done while collecting a paycheck and having a retirement funded by your ALPA dues.
If at some point you'd actually like to discuss structural issues rather than personal failings (plenty of those on both sides of your issue), I'd welcome it. I'll be happy to compare the structure and actual records of CAPA, Teamsters, Independents and ALPA as I've done throughout this thread. But you're not going to get free reign to revise what actually happened in the past in order to try to attempt to alter the future for our association and pilot group. I thought you already acknowledged that offer earlier in this thread...
[deleted]
Last edited by vagabond; 10-31-2010 at 04:16 PM. Reason: deleted personal identifier
10-31-2010, 08:52 AM
#2000
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: B-7ER JFK
Posts: 931
Originally Posted by TheManager
It is part of a formula, commonly seen in lounge shows prior to any memrat.
1. F U D. Misinfo. Fear - Uncertainty - Doubt. Spread misinformation.
When that does not work it is racheted up to the next level.
2. Admit nothing. Deny, and deny everything. Make counter accusations.
And finally, if the above two do not work, the fall back is:
3. "We (I) have information you don't. I have seen (fill in the blank) and I'd like to tell you more but I can not because we (I) have signed a confidentiality agreement."
1. F U D. Misinfo. Fear - Uncertainty - Doubt. Spread misinformation.
When that does not work it is racheted up to the next level.
2. Admit nothing. Deny, and deny everything. Make counter accusations.
And finally, if the above two do not work, the fall back is:
3. "We (I) have information you don't. I have seen (fill in the blank) and I'd like to tell you more but I can not because we (I) have signed a confidentiality agreement."
Level 2 already....
Last edited by vagabond; 10-31-2010 at 04:17 PM.
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