Thank you. I also think it is important to have a opportunity to hear both sides.

SkyHigh

 

I would have been slightly senior to you had we both stayed. I left at 2d year capt -200 pay making that much. The guy one number junior to me is still there making 8th year -400 capt pay at 75K+. If your buds have upgraded, which they should have since 5 year guys have upgraded or are in class now, they'd be at least at the advertised 7th year -200 capt pay of 58K. A guy that was two classes behind us is an RJ capt.

 

Well, What can I say? Perhaps you are throwing per diem, dry cleaning and over time into that number? My friends are not making it to the 58K mark yet and no one had mentioned the CRJ as a possibility yet. They do think the 400 will be an option in a few years though. They all have families and couldn't jump at every upgrade opportunity anyway.

We are missing the big picture here. In Vancouver Washington a starting firefighter without any college or paramedic training starts at over 50K. By the time they reach the 9 year point they are easlity reaching 100K with a little over time, work only 9 days a month and are almost half way to retirement. No matter how you slice it a regional career is not worth the effort when compared to other comperible careers.

SkyHigh

 

That's their choice. They could easily hold CRJ Captain in Denver, and be making close to what I cited.

 

I still don't know about that but I do know that they could also take jobs overseas that pay double or tripple what they are earning at Horizon. A few could also go back to Alaska and fly a 207 or Beaver and make more money.

You are right it is a choice, however some are not loner pilot geeks. They have wives, friends and children. QOL is an issue for most. Accepting an upgrade that would force a move and being on night reserve for the next few years isn't that much of an advancement.

SkyHigh

 

When I go to the APC page for Horizon and enter 9th year pay for a CRJ captain I come up with $76,440. After taxes it is around 61K. Not to bad if it was for a 28 year old kid without mouths to feed.

When I calculate 9 year pay for a Dash 200 it comes to $53,760 before taxes.

This is a common problem with pilots. Not only do they try to throw everything in but the kitchen sink in order to artificially inflate their stated income, but they fail to reflect upon the challenges, losses and sacrifices it took to get there.

54K for a middle aged man who has spent the last 20 years in the profession is not good. To some high school kid it might seem like a good deal but when compared to a school teacher or Wendy's manager it is horrible.

SkyHigh

 

Whoops, slow yourself WAYYYYY down, there. The correct figure is very close to $80K (which is in the ballpark of your figure). My original estimate was based on my guess of your seniority (oops, sorry, you haven't any seniority any more) and not an attempt to 'throw everything in'. That's very close to calling me a liar, and not at all appreciated. I only included the 401k because we have a ridiculously good match that appreciably changes our compensation. No dry cleaning reimbursement included, since that got gutted in this contract ($15 per month- woohoo)!

That's fine to say that these guys can only make $54K at QX because they don't want to move, or even commute, but you can't then blame Horizon because they could MOVE AND MAKE MORE ELSEWHERE! Apples to apples, please. A new hire out of UND at age 22 would be making $80K at about 29. No, he or she isn't getting rich by any stretch, but that's not poverty, either.

 

Wow $61k after taxes is not enough for a family? I must be really sluming it

 

I agree that SWA gotta slow down at some point, but than I'd never have guessed (15 years ago) that SWA would even try to make a presence on the East coast; so much for my crystal ball!
While I wouldn't want to be 45 looking to get in at a regional, many pilots at FDX have started at 40 something and are happy with (what little) career they will have before retirement. Agreed, it would be different at a "real" airline, still you got to do what makes you happy.
Older pilots should look carefully at the retirements (or lack there of) of their future/present employer. Considerations of upgrade due to retirements are one area were an older vs younger pilot should make differing career decision's based on the demographics of their airline. SWA, would, on the face of it, be a less desirable choice than, say, CAL due to retirements in the near to medium time period.

 

Skyain'tsohigh,

Enough of the pity party. Horizon is a great airline and you demean a lot of great folks who have made it their career. They may not be getting rich, but a maxed out Horizon Captain is still in the top 5% of wage earners nationwide.
There is also a lot to be said for security. It is far more comfortable to make 50k a year and know that it will be there every pay period than 100k and always be wondering if your next check is your last.

I don't think you have a clue as to wages in the real world. I also don't think you're ever going to match in the grounded world what you could have had at Horizon.

Since I first started flying 30 years ago, there have always been boo-birds giving me all the reasons that I shouldn't follow my dream. I am sure glad that I didn't listen to them.

If you are convinced you are going to fail, then you are absolutely right.

For all you young wannabes out there, if you think you were born to fly then go for it because you won't be happy doing anything else. At its worst, flying for a living still beats the pants off of working for a living. As you climb the ladder you will see others fall, but that is life and is inherent to any profession worth having. One thing about pilot culture is that pilots are the last ones who will ever admit to making a mistake and are bred to always find someone or something else to blame when things don't turn out.