Before You Consider F9...
03-04-2015, 10:52 AM
#1
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Thread Starter
Joined APC: Apr 2011
Position: CW20
Posts: 130
Before You Consider F9...
A bit of perspective is in order. The company is in the midst of a major operational meltdown of sorts. To be expected in some degree, but I am hoping that the personal impact on YOU, a potential employee, will be thoughtfully considered. I can safely say that management/labor relations are at an all time low. A solid year at least, of contract violations, indifference to individuals and outright disrespect to a large number of pilots. By design or by mistake, there has been a calculated, measured attempt to pound out every cost they can to YOUR DETRIMENT. The contract is being steamrolled every day, people can't 1) get paid correctly 2) get insurance premiums straight 3) get answers or respectable information from nearly every office at the GO. And on and on. If you are looking to beef up your resumes or use it as a stepping stone, than do it. We are facing the most hostile management found just about anyplace. If you can live with the worst pay in the industry and the level of contempt, then by all means, come on in. In spite of a major push by FAPA, your pay and especially insurance/ retirement, will be substandard FOR YEARS. We aren't amendable for a while and all that will be is a countdown to at least 5 years of Section 6. Go someplace where the crap is similar, but at least you will get paid correctly and you won't feel like needing a shower after talking to management.
03-04-2015, 11:06 AM
#2
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Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: 7ERB
Posts: 2,039
Originally Posted by DC7C
A bit of perspective is in order. The company is in the midst of a major operational meltdown of sorts. To be expected in some degree, but I am hoping that the personal impact on YOU, a potential employee, will be thoughtfully considered. I can safely say that management/labor relations are at an all time low. A solid year at least, of contract violations, indifference to individuals and outright disrespect to a large number of pilots. By design or by mistake, there has been a calculated, measured attempt to pound out every cost they can to YOUR DETRIMENT. The contract is being steamrolled every day, people can't 1) get paid correctly 2) get insurance premiums straight 3) get answers or respectable information from nearly every office at the GO. And on and on. If you are looking to beef up your resumes or use it as a stepping stone, than do it. We are facing the most hostile management found just about anyplace. If you can live with the worst pay in the industry and the level of contempt, then by all means, come on in. In spite of a major push by FAPA, your pay and especially insurance/ retirement, will be substandard FOR YEARS. We aren't amendable for a while and all that will be is a countdown to at least 5 years of Section 6. Go someplace where the crap is similar, but at least you will get paid correctly and you won't feel like needing a shower after talking to management.
Maybe it is time for your Union to be the most "hostile group" Frontier Management has seen?
On other threads, all that is posted is how great the company and new leadership are.
Dont be held hostage by an imaginary or promised $300,000. Start pushing back.
Good Luck,
TEN
03-04-2015, 11:18 AM
#3
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Joined APC: Oct 2009
Position: B756 FO
Posts: 1,288
Originally Posted by DC7C
A bit of perspective is in order. The company is in the midst of a major operational meltdown of sorts. To be expected in some degree, but I am hoping that the personal impact on YOU, a potential employee, will be thoughtfully considered. I can safely say that management/labor relations are at an all time low. A solid year at least, of contract violations, indifference to individuals and outright disrespect to a large number of pilots. By design or by mistake, there has been a calculated, measured attempt to pound out every cost they can to YOUR DETRIMENT. The contract is being steamrolled every day, people can't 1) get paid correctly 2) get insurance premiums straight 3) get answers or respectable information from nearly every office at the GO. And on and on. If you are looking to beef up your resumes or use it as a stepping stone, than do it. We are facing the most hostile management found just about anyplace. If you can live with the worst pay in the industry and the level of contempt, then by all means, come on in. In spite of a major push by FAPA, your pay and especially insurance/ retirement, will be substandard FOR YEARS. We aren't amendable for a while and all that will be is a countdown to at least 5 years of Section 6. Go someplace where the crap is similar, but at least you will get paid correctly and you won't feel like needing a shower after talking to management.
Wow what happened over there? Just a few months ago you particularly were spewing all these cocky sayings to RAH guys like "told ya so", regarding your new deal with Indigo. Sorry to see that kind of back fired on you.
To the good guys at Frontier, I feel for you guys. Stand strong and I hope you all pull out of this for the better.
03-04-2015, 12:47 PM
#5
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Joined APC: Mar 2011
Posts: 178
Originally Posted by DC7C
A bit of perspective is in order. The company is in the midst of a major operational meltdown of sorts. To be expected in some degree, but I am hoping that the personal impact on YOU, a potential employee, will be thoughtfully considered. I can safely say that management/labor relations are at an all time low. A solid year at least, of contract violations, indifference to individuals and outright disrespect to a large number of pilots. By design or by mistake, there has been a calculated, measured attempt to pound out every cost they can to YOUR DETRIMENT. The contract is being steamrolled every day, people can't 1) get paid correctly 2) get insurance premiums straight 3) get answers or respectable information from nearly every office at the GO. And on and on. If you are looking to beef up your resumes or use it as a stepping stone, than do it. We are facing the most hostile management found just about anyplace. If you can live with the worst pay in the industry and the level of contempt, then by all means, come on in. In spite of a major push by FAPA, your pay and especially insurance/ retirement, will be substandard FOR YEARS. We aren't amendable for a while and all that will be is a countdown to at least 5 years of Section 6. Go someplace where the crap is similar, but at least you will get paid correctly and you won't feel like needing a shower after talking to management.
03-04-2015, 01:32 PM
#6
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Joined APC: Nov 2012
Position: 1900D CA
Posts: 3,395
Before you consider F9...know that there are employees with bad attitudes everywhere. Every company with a unionized workforce has issues between management and the employees. Are things at frontier really like what was described above? Not even close. Have a few people had minor issues with the company not interpreting the contract the way they want? Of course. I for one, have never once had a single problem. Every penny owed to me was paid to me on time and without issue.
Now, there is no doubt the company is trying to cut cost across the board. We are desperately trying to lower our cost to match Spirit. The company might not like guys getting two 5 day trips dropped by one week of vacation and then picking them right back up for double pay, but you can do it. Management won't even try to run you over with a steamroller.
Frontier has a good contract with low pay. Frontier is growing rapidly, and pay is coming back to pre bankruptcy rates. We have a tough fight ahead for our new contract. Indigo plays hardball, no doubt. But them playing hardball also is letting frontier grow like never before, just like spirit.
If you are interesting in frontier and believe in the ULCC model, you should apply. You won't get "steamrolled" by management.
Now, there is no doubt the company is trying to cut cost across the board. We are desperately trying to lower our cost to match Spirit. The company might not like guys getting two 5 day trips dropped by one week of vacation and then picking them right back up for double pay, but you can do it. Management won't even try to run you over with a steamroller.
Frontier has a good contract with low pay. Frontier is growing rapidly, and pay is coming back to pre bankruptcy rates. We have a tough fight ahead for our new contract. Indigo plays hardball, no doubt. But them playing hardball also is letting frontier grow like never before, just like spirit.
If you are interesting in frontier and believe in the ULCC model, you should apply. You won't get "steamrolled" by management.
03-09-2015, 06:04 PM
#7
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Position: A320 FO
Posts: 93
Originally Posted by Kritchlow
Yes, I'm a newb at f9. While I understand things are far from perfect, this seems to be a bit over-the-top on the pessimistic side. I don't have a lot of experience here so I could be wrong, but I've heard this song about virtually every company at one point in time.
03-09-2015, 06:07 PM
#8
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2013
Position: A320 FO
Posts: 93
Originally Posted by Aero1900
Before you consider F9...know that there are employees with bad attitudes everywhere. Every company with a unionized workforce has issues between management and the employees. Are things at frontier really like what was described above? Not even close. Have a few people had minor issues with the company not interpreting the contract the way they want? Of course. I for one, have never once had a single problem. Every penny owed to me was paid to me on time and without issue.
Now, there is no doubt the company is trying to cut cost across the board. We are desperately trying to lower our cost to match Spirit. The company might not like guys getting two 5 day trips dropped by one week of vacation and then picking them right back up for double pay, but you can do it. Management won't even try to run you over with a steamroller.
Frontier has a good contract with low pay. Frontier is growing rapidly, and pay is coming back to pre bankruptcy rates. We have a tough fight ahead for our new contract. Indigo plays hardball, no doubt. But them playing hardball also is letting frontier grow like never before, just like spirit.
If you are interesting in frontier and believe in the ULCC model, you should apply. You won't get "steamrolled" by management.
Now, there is no doubt the company is trying to cut cost across the board. We are desperately trying to lower our cost to match Spirit. The company might not like guys getting two 5 day trips dropped by one week of vacation and then picking them right back up for double pay, but you can do it. Management won't even try to run you over with a steamroller.
Frontier has a good contract with low pay. Frontier is growing rapidly, and pay is coming back to pre bankruptcy rates. We have a tough fight ahead for our new contract. Indigo plays hardball, no doubt. But them playing hardball also is letting frontier grow like never before, just like spirit.
If you are interesting in frontier and believe in the ULCC model, you should apply. You won't get "steamrolled" by management.
03-09-2015, 06:14 PM
#9
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2011
Posts: 178
Originally Posted by Cross Check
Did you read the union email that was sent out basically describing what the OP said? Either you are delusional or in denial. Get with the team and fight!
03-09-2015, 06:20 PM
#10
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Joined APC: Feb 2010
Posts: 519
Originally Posted by DC7C
A bit of perspective is in order. The company is in the midst of a major operational meltdown of sorts. To be expected in some degree, but I am hoping that the personal impact on YOU, a potential employee, will be thoughtfully considered. I can safely say that management/labor relations are at an all time low. A solid year at least, of contract violations, indifference to individuals and outright disrespect to a large number of pilots. By design or by mistake, there has been a calculated, measured attempt to pound out every cost they can to YOUR DETRIMENT. The contract is being steamrolled every day, people can't 1) get paid correctly 2) get insurance premiums straight 3) get answers or respectable information from nearly every office at the GO. And on and on. If you are looking to beef up your resumes or use it as a stepping stone, than do it. We are facing the most hostile management found just about anyplace. If you can live with the worst pay in the industry and the level of contempt, then by all means, come on in. In spite of a major push by FAPA, your pay and especially insurance/ retirement, will be substandard FOR YEARS. We aren't amendable for a while and all that will be is a countdown to at least 5 years of Section 6. Go someplace where the crap is similar, but at least you will get paid correctly and you won't feel like needing a shower after talking to management.
