A6ETrammn

Looks like most don't have the "real" information. DALPA's merged list proposal included all the aircraft options that DAL has. DALPA would not acknowledge the options that NWA had.

Currently DAL operates 32 aircraft that pay wide-body rates, 22 767-400s and 10 777s. NWA operates 60 aircraft that pay wide-body rates. 32 A330s, 16 747-400s, and 12 747-200s. NWA also has 18 firm orders for 787s and options for 50 more. DAL has firm orders for 6 777-20LRs, and options for 16 767-400s, and 11 777-200LRs with rolling options for 12 777-200LRs.

So DALPA was demanding (yes that word is correct) credit for 39 aircraft it may or may not get, and refusing to acknowledge 50 aircraft that NWA may or may not get. This added an additional 1000 DAL pilots that don't even work there.

Just the facts.

Scoop

I guess thats one way to look at it, but here is another way to look at it:Currently DAL flies 247 aircraft that pay $160/hr or more.Currently NW flies 63 aircraft that pay $160/hr or more.These numbers come from the airline profile page of this website. Check it out if you are interested. Scoop

sailingfun

Your facts are a little off. Both NWA and DALPA agreed to account for growth via the respective companies business plans prior to the merger annoucement. This was using planned block hours in both companies plans. Included in this was a agreement to account for NWA's retirements. It was only after a list was produced by DALPA using those numbers that NWA realized how bad it screwed their junior pilots and backed away from their own concept. They then said the Delta business plan was based on options and not real aircraft. They did not mention that Delta has the most flexible and convenient deal with Boeing of any airline. They do not have to confirm a order until 18 months prior to delivery. They have 45 777 slots reserved between now and 2015 plus a large number of 737 slots. They don't have to confirm each one until 18 months prior and that is how they will be ordered. The interesting thing is that there was basically a conceptual agreement on how to merge the lists until NWA saw the results. Hopefully we can put it all together in the next round of talks and not need to go to arbitration.

StripAlert

I'm a little confused... So you're saying that NWA's A-330's pay "wide-body rates" at $162, while discounting 216 of Delta's B-757's and B-767's because they only pay $160? Seems like splitting hairs to me. Plus, if you factor in the $5 international override, you've at least got to admit that Delta's 757/767-ER flying actually pays more than NWA's "wide-body rates," and that's over 70 aircraft alone right there, and doesn't even include all the domestic category 757 and 767 flying to the Caribbean and Central America, which also pays the international override, so I think your argument's officially toast. (Not to mention that the aircraft Delta has options on actually exist...)

Justdoinmyjob

Wow,
I always thought that 767s and 767ERs were wide body aircraft. I always use "Heavy" in the call sign when flying them, and I seem to remember that they have 2 aisles in them. What else makes an airplane a wide body?

Scoop

That may explain why I walk into a row of seats every time I try to walk down the middle of the fuselage! Wow I didn't know a plane could be a widebody unles NW flew it. Scoop

Opus

Scoop,

Do you guys still do T.K Rows? He was a NWA guy that got a procedure named after him after getting a little off(Well maybe more than a little) course. I heard we sent that intl procedure over to you guys years ago. We stopped doing it a couple of years ago.

A6ETrammn

>>>"Wow,
I always thought that 767s and 767ERs were wide body aircraft. I always use "Heavy" in the call sign when flying them, and I seem to remember that they have 2 aisles in them. What else makes an airplane a wide body?<<<

Actually, prior to all of the bankruptcy give backs, the 767s, other than the ERs paid what a narrowbody 757 paid at NWA. Yes NWA did take bigger paycuts, bummer, so if you are using Bankruptcy payscales, then yes at this moment in time the pay is the same. Here we only use widebody aircraft internationally along with some narrowbody aircraft lately, sorry for the confusion.

One of the reasons for this stock swap is cash on hand at NWA. I believe the number is upwards of $4 Billion. DAL has around $2.5 Billion. The deal is about money, run by money managers. We as pilots are an afterthought. We'll have to work together eventually, if the deal gets approved. They, RA and friends, will split the cash and bolt when they can. Richard did it here, he has a track record.

Reroute

[quote=A6ETrammn;374572
Actually, prior to all of the bankruptcy give backs, the 767s, other than the ERs paid what a narrowbody 757 paid at NWA.

[COLOR=blue]?????? The DAL 767, 757 and ER paid the same prior to the bankruptcy give backs and they pay the same today. So if the ER paid more, so did the 767 and 757.[/COLOR]

Yes NWA did take bigger paycuts, bummer, so if you are using Bankruptcy payscales, then yes at this moment in time the pay is the same. Here we only use widebody aircraft internationally along with some narrowbody aircraft lately, sorry for the confusion.

DAL has a much larger international category than NWA and I believe DAL's 757s and 767s paid more than NWA 757s prior to BK.

A6ETrammn

[quote=Reroute;374586]
As quoted earlier, splitting hairs. Point is the two companies are not that different, except for the major exodus DAL had prior to the bankruptcy. That has caused a "potential" issue since NWA has major retirements in the next 5 years where DAL has already experienced them. Not sure where the options counted in the DAL business plan were ok'd by the NWA merger committee came from, if you have a source I would like to pursue that. In addition, now I'm just relaying what was put out at a meeting, there was no, repeat, no integration method even agreed upon. There were discussions, but nothing was agreed upon therefore there was never a list. So to say that the original list agreed upon included DAL options and then NWA realized oh s@*t is suspect, to say the least.