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Airline Pilot Central Forums (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/)
-   Other (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/other/)
-   -   Silver Airways (https://www.airlinepilotforums.com/other/64199-silver-airways.html)

Salukipilot4590 02-09-2014 04:46 PM
...so what's everyone going to do when this thing passes?

tom11011 02-09-2014 05:42 PM
Originally Posted by Salukipilot4590 (Post 1578034)
...so what's everyone going to do when this thing passes?
The bigger question is what to do about your union representation. This is what they negotiated for you on your behalf. The news articles state the following.

“We are extremely pleased with the outcome of our efforts,” said Captain Richard Green, Silver Executive Council Chairman for Local 1224. “We were not interested in discussions that didn’t benefit our members. This new agreement addressed key outstanding issues we wanted resolved, and it will provide economic gains and quality of life improvements for all of our pilots.”
Captain Daniel Wells, president of the Airline Professional Association Teamsters Local 1224, who is also a 747 captain with Atlas Air and 28-year industry veteran, added “We believe this outcome should serve as a model for the rest of the regional airline industry.
You are being asked to eat a sh*t sandwhich and call it prime rib.

Salukipilot4590 02-09-2014 05:50 PM
Originally Posted by tom11011 (Post 1578071)
The bigger question is what to do about your union representation. This is what they negotiated for you on your behalf. The news articles state the following.

You are being asked to eat a sh*t sandwhich and call it prime rib.
Well to be honest that's why it has to be put to a vote. They think it's a good contract, and I don't fault them for thinking that since it took effort to get what they got, but it's not a good contract for me...this is why I'm going to tell them no (via a no vote). I'm not going to crucify the poor guy(s) because this LOA stinks (IMHO), just going to play the game.

Full disclosure I'm an ex-Waterski so union games are my thing.

That being said it's going to be fun to sit in on a roadshow and observe. I'm not going to say much since I know lots of guys have similar feelings, I'm just going to sit there with my patented "chocolate bear smile™"

:D

tom11011 02-09-2014 06:10 PM
Originally Posted by Salukipilot4590 (Post 1578074)
Well to be honest that's why it has to be put to a vote. They think it's a good contract, and I don't fault them for thinking that since it took effort to get what they got, but it's not a good contract for me...this is why I'm going to tell them no (via a no vote). I'm not going to crucify the poor guy(s) because this LOA stinks (IMHO), just going to play the game.

Full disclosure I'm an ex-Waterski so union games are my thing.

That being said it's going to be fun to sit in on a roadshow and observe. I'm not going to say much since I know lots of guys have similar feelings, I'm just going to sit there with my patented "chocolate bear smile™"

:D
But the problem is it could pass even with your no vote. Maybe the membership should ask that the representation go back to the drawing board without a vote. IE- have a vote on whether this vote should even be presented to the membership based on that single point. That single point has the potential to do more harm to all involved, it needs to be rethought. It's not good for the company or its employees. Maybe neither side thought the ramifications through enough.

Salukipilot4590 02-09-2014 06:13 PM
Originally Posted by tom11011 (Post 1578087)
But the problem is it could pass even with your no vote. Maybe the membership should ask that the representation go back to the drawing board without a vote. IE- have a vote on whether this vote should even be presented to the membership.
Good point but I think it would be a MUCH better point to educate everyone on why this is not a good deal and have a 90% fail vote instead of a "Hey let's go back and try again."

I've had too much coffee so I'm rambling in my mind.

tom11011 02-09-2014 06:18 PM
Originally Posted by Salukipilot4590 (Post 1578091)
Good point but I think it would be a MUCH better point to educate everyone on why this is not a good deal and have a 90% fail vote instead of a "Hey let's go back and try again."

I've had too much coffee so I'm rambling in my mind.
Your not rambling. I hope your right.

It's probably safe to say though that at a minimum, any Captain not on reserve is likely going to vote in favor of any change that enriches their personal standing-- unless of course they are not short sighted individuals who can see the bigger picture.

Salukipilot4590 02-09-2014 06:23 PM
Originally Posted by tom11011 (Post 1578096)
Your not rambling. I hope your right.

It's probably safe to say though that at a minimum, any Captain not on reserve is likely going to vote in favor of any change that enriches their personal standing-- unless of course they are not short sighted individuals who can see the bigger picture.
Thats the hope! All we can do right now is educate other pilots on the pros and cons. The union is going to try and sell this LOA because that's their job, that's what they are paid for. We as mature adults have to weigh the pros and cons then vote, that's our job. If FL based captains/FOs vote yes because they want 6K in 12 months and never think they'll be on reserve that's their perogative.

If it passes it passes. It'll be sad to leave Silver but that's what some of us will have to do to maintain our sanity and QOL.

tom11011 02-09-2014 06:28 PM
Originally Posted by Salukipilot4590 (Post 1578098)
Thats the hope! All we can do right now is educate other pilots on the pros and cons. The union is going to try and sell this LOA because that's their job, that's what they are paid for. We as mature adults have to weigh the pros and cons then vote, that's our job. If FL based captains/FOs vote yes because they want 6K in 12 months and never think they'll be on reserve that's their perogative.

If it passes it passes. It'll be sad to leave Silver but that's what some of us will have to do to maintain our sanity and QOL.
You might remind as many people as you can that the intention of this is that it serves as a model for the rest of the industry according to Captain Daniel Wells. Don't want that either.

Some pilots are going to say "hey, were getting 9 out of 10 things we want. No contract is perfect so I guess we'll take it." But the problem is it will replicate like a virus throughout the industry.

Salukipilot4590 02-09-2014 06:32 PM
Originally Posted by tom11011 (Post 1578102)
You might remind as many people as you can that the intention of this is that it serves as a model for the rest of the industry according to Captain Daniel Wells. Don't want that either.

Some pilots are going to say "hey, were getting 9 out of 10 things we want. No contract is perfect so I guess we'll take it." But the problem is it will replicate like a virus throughout the industry.
All I have to say is:

"Reference: PSA"

The virus has already found a host.

Polarfr8dog 02-09-2014 06:39 PM
can you give us some details regarding pay, benefits, etc., for those of us on the outside? Curious as to what 1224 negotiated as I'm a member and can't find anything on the website

Thanks in Advance.


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